Does Sonic Battle take place after Sonic Heroes?

Owen Axel · Post by **Owen Axel** » Fri May 28, 2004 12:04 pm

What with these later games having this crazy idea of continuity in them. I know Battle was released prior to Heroes, but plot stuff seems to suggest the timeline is otherwise.

Rouge mentions Chaos Gamma reminding her of Omega, who first showed up in Heroes. And nobody goes "Ahh! Ghosty!" at the sight of Shadow prancing around like he never dropped dead.

As an afterthough, what the hell was up with all the Shadow clones in Heroes?

Post by **Green Gibbon!** » Fri May 28, 2004 1:12 pm

As an afterthough, what the hell was up with all the Shadow clones in Heroes?

My assumption is that Eggman was trying to create an army of Shadow clones because that's the way his mind operates. "If one can't do the job, what the hell, a billion of 'em should do the trick!"

However, I'm sure it could also be theorized that Shadow in SA2 was already one of several hundred clones.

Owen Axel · Post by **Owen Axel** » Fri May 28, 2004 1:29 pm

You're probably right. Didn't make sense that Metal Sonic would start pumping out Shadow clones, since he only needed one to copy data from.

Hope this doesn't mean a Matrix Reloaded type event with thousands of Shadows jumping about and doing stuff in a future installment. One of my favourite things about stuff that's called Ultimate-whatever is that there's generally juse one of them.

Post by **Esrever** » Fri May 28, 2004 1:42 pm

I assumed it was Metal Sonic that made all of the Shadow clones, since they were all on his battleship. I figured they were going to be his conquering army or something. I suppose he just as easily could have stolen them all from Eggman, but he must have intended to use them for something since he bothered to bring them along with the Egg Fleet.

Post by **G.Silver** » Fri May 28, 2004 2:20 pm

Did Metal Sonic really want to rule the world though? I thought his objective was just the elimination of Sonic (that stupid "come and get me" plot device at the beginning finally makes sense), and therefore the Egg Fleet was only used to make it look like Eggman was behind it, and as material for Metal's akira-like transformation. I suspect the Shadows were just along for the ride.

Post by **Green Gibbon!** » Fri May 28, 2004 2:49 pm

I don't think Metal Sonic actually created the battleship, I was under the impression he just assumed control of it when he subdued Eggman. Like, Eggman created the Egg Fleet and all this high-tech stuff because he does that sort of thing alot, all the while Metal Sonic was still just planning from the shadows, then the Egg Fleet project gets off the ground and at some point there Metal Sonic makes his move, locks up Eggman, assumes control of the fleet, and sends that fake letter to Sonic.

As Silv says, I don't think Metal has any desire to conquer the world, he just wants to beat Sonic.

Rouge's strange comment to Omega about Shadow being an android would also make sense. She didn't seem too surprised at all to see the army of Shadow clones. Since the original Shadow was a creation of Gerald, and Eggman seems to possess of all of Gerald's journals, it would make perfect sense that he could use the data to create some more. This also brings back the question of whether or not the Shadow in Sonic Heroes is the real one from SA2 or just one of the copies.

Post by **Esrever** » Fri May 28, 2004 3:09 pm

Ah, gothcha.

I think the Shadow you play as in Heroes has to be the same one from SA2. He was kept seperate from the other Shadows, locked up in a secret safe by himself. He seems to regain his memories at the end of the Team Dark game.

But most importantly, he is the Shadow from which Metal Sonic copies the "Ultimate Lifeform Data." If the Shadow Rouge found was just another clone, then Metal could just as easily have copied the same data from any of the other clones on the battleship. I assumed that indicated that there must be something different/special about that particular Shadow.

Then again, perhaps I'm overanalysing a plot that has bigger holes in it than... Popcorn's mom.

Post by **Green Gibbon!** » Fri May 28, 2004 4:47 pm

Also, if he possessed the data to make clones, he probably wouldn't have gone out of his way to procure the original one in SA2, he'd have just used the data to create his own then and there. It may be that he couldn't make that army of copies until he had acquired the original (or remains of it) and studied it for himself.

Zeta · Post by **Zeta** » Fri May 28, 2004 4:59 pm

The big question is, if SB takes place after SH - what happened to Metal Sonic and E-123?

Personally, I think they're off somewhere having oily, metallic, gay, robotic, sex.

Owen Axel · Post by **Owen Axel** » Fri May 28, 2004 5:02 pm

Omega destroyed all the other Shadow clones at the end, right? It's been awhile.

Hope Metal isn't past his prime now that he's had a whole game to himself for playing the villain in.

Zeta · Post by **Zeta** » Fri May 28, 2004 5:20 pm

I wonder if it's just coincidence that the two games where Metal Sonic transformed into a gigantic monsterous enemy and acted as the last boss sucked donkey balls?

Owen Axel · Post by **Owen Axel** » Fri May 28, 2004 5:29 pm

I wouldn't know. I rather enjoyed Knuckles Chaotix.

Heroes could definitely have been a lot less sucky, though.

Post by **Green Gibbon!** » Fri May 28, 2004 6:38 pm

I still think Charmy or perhaps Vector is the jinx.

If anything, it should only fuel Metal Sonic's raging inferiority complex.

Post by **Delphine** » Fri May 28, 2004 8:11 pm

Charmy's definitely the jinx. Vector was cool in Chaotix. They turned him into a punk-ass bitch in SH, but he USED to be cool.

plasticwingsband · Post by **plasticwingsband** » Fri May 28, 2004 8:15 pm

I just remember the part in SH when Vector said something along the lines of, "Not those ones, silly!" That was... odd, to say the least.

Zeta · Post by **Zeta** » Fri May 28, 2004 8:26 pm

Maybe the Chaotix should fire Charmy and re-hire Mighty?

Speaking of which, it took me months of searching to discover Mighty was an armadillo. He's definately the most poorly drawn Sonic character of all time. I had thought he was a very ugly badger when I first saw him.

Post by **Segaholic2** » Fri May 28, 2004 8:27 pm

He's basically a modified Sonic. There are sites that prove this.

Post by **Delphine** » Fri May 28, 2004 8:28 pm

Segaholic2 wrote:He's basically a modified Sonic. There are sites that prove this.

Yeah, pretty much. Probably why he dissapeared. I mean, there wasn't even a cameo of him. He could've been in a picture or something.

Ngangbius · Post by **Ngangbius** » Fri May 28, 2004 8:40 pm

Delphine wrote:
Segaholic2 wrote:He's basically a modified Sonic. There are sites that prove this.
Yeah, pretty much. Probably why he dissapeared. I mean, there wasn't even a cameo of him. He could've been in a picture or something.

And yet, Shadow still exist. Go fig.

plasticwingsband wrote:I just remember the part in SH when Vector said something along the lines of, "Not those ones, silly!" That was... odd, to say the least.

Almost all of the dialogue in Sonic Heroes ranged from to laughably bad to annoyingly bad.

Post by **Delphine** » Fri May 28, 2004 9:33 pm

Shadow's the angsty anti-hero, we can't get rid of him.

Owen Axel · Post by **Owen Axel** » Sat May 29, 2004 4:03 am

It's worth keeping Shadow around just to get the occasional break from the kiddiness. Espio, too.

I like characters who never laugh. Chuckle, maybe, but never laugh.

Post by **Crazy Penguin** » Sat May 29, 2004 4:36 am

Esrever wrote:I think the Shadow you play as in Heroes has to be the same one from SA2. He was kept seperate from the other Shadows, locked up in a secret safe by himself. He seems to regain his memories at the end of the Team Dark game.

In the level after the battle with Team Sonic (the castle), if you leave Team Dark standing arond for a while Shadow sometimes says "Sonic...why does that name bother me so much?"

In Sonic Battle he seems to perfectly remember moments from Sonic Adventure 2. So it's either the guy from SA2, or his memories aren't real.

Zeta · Post by **Zeta** » Sat May 29, 2004 7:00 am

It's almost like that damnable Crimson Spider saga all over again.

Post by **Crazy Penguin** » Sat May 29, 2004 8:26 am

Zeta wrote:It's almost like that damnable Crimson Spider saga all over again.

Scarlet Spider. Ben Reilly was cool biotch.

Post by **Popcorn** » Sat May 29, 2004 9:02 am

Ben Reilly was cool.

I didn't even finish Sonic Heroes. I got it and thought I'd at least finish Team Sonic's story, but I lost interest entirely at the second Egg Fleet stage.

I did check out a movie of the final cut scene, though: the bit where Metal turns back into his Sonic CD self is kind of heart-rending, if only because it made me think "Fuck me, Metal Sonic used to be so damn cool."