Sonic Unleashed?

[gr4yJ4Y]

Sonic and the Black Knight is looking better visually in stills than Wii Unleashed though, sporting a better Sonic model, lighting and shadows, however obviously it wont feature anything even close to as fast as Unleashed so it wont have to deal with rendering a shitload at once.

How do you know it won't be as fast as Unleashed? Where are you getting this from?

[James McGeachie]

Uh well all the info posted in the topic about it made it certainly sound like a slower experience and not to mention if it involves combat while running, realistically it just isn't going to be as fast.

The entire premise just sounds like a slower concept, it's kind of natural to assume it's not going to be moving at the same blinding pace that Unleashed is, or at the very least not as often.

[James McGeachie]

Uh well all the info posted in the topic about it made it certainly sound like a slower experience and if it involves combat while running, realistically it just isn't going to be as fast.

The entire premise just sounds like a slower concept, it's kind of natural to assume it's not going to be moving at the same blinding pace that Unleashed is, or at the very least not as often.

[Shadow Hog]

Dude, the edit button doesn't vanish THAT fast.

But yeah, I'd imagine Black Knight would be at a slower pace. Actually, I kind of hope it does - that might mean they can focus on some proper platforming segments instead of just "GOTTA GO FAST GOTTA GO FAST GOTTA GO FASTER FASTER FASTERFASTERFASTER". Which'd be nice. Fast-paced platforming, fine, since it'd have to be to be in-character, but not something so fast that platforming takes a step to the side entirely.

It's not impossible to do fast-paced slicing-and-dicing, either (just look at Strider, or, to an extent, any Mega Man game featuring a playable Zero), but I'll wait to see some videos before giving my opinion on that one.

And that reviewer should never talk about Sonic ever again. Ever. Just... gah. GAH.

[DackAttac]

Agreed. He's already decided they werehog stages'll receive something close to a 3 without fucking playing them. All over a principle that's been draining the subtlety out of the series. It's the principle of driving 80 mph in the passing lane on the highway versus driving 45 mph on more scenic, winding routes. One's faster than the other, yeah, but one's definitely more fun, and it's faster than walking anyway, so why knock it for not being the fastest? In fact, anyone who says they're thinking of a number without ever playing the game they're assigning it to deserves to be stripped of all reviewer credentials. It's bad enough to harbor a prerelease material-fueled bias, but advertising it is just stupid.

I agree with what I think Isuka was getting at, though... the quote the rep said was certainly applaudable, but the way they've gone about implementing it is less than admirable. The whole ying and yang works best when they're happening simultaneously, not at different times. It's like fucking your friend's girlfriend on Friday and then making up for it by blowing him on Saturday—if you can merge the offense with the atonement by not doing anything to his girlfriend or his penis, it'll probably be a better weekend for everyone.

Although the fact the different takes happen in the same levels but with passages only accessible by certain forms harks back to S3&K... but that really just drives home the question of why isn't it Knuckles?

[j-man]

You make the best analogies ever.

[Rob-Bert]

It isn't Knuckles because then people would be complaining about Knuckles participating in a story that doesn't involve Angel Island or the Master Emerald. The team behind this is smarter than we thought.

[Shadow Hog]

Would they really complain? He always seems to get a free ride in his participation, since he's a "classic" character, but I rarely see anyone call him out on not guarding the Master Emerald. He literally has become a character who's only appearing because the kids think he's cool, and has been flanderized to the point that he's just a stupid gullible strong guy who's friends with Sonic. Sadly, while WE realize this, there are still some fans who haven't quite figured it out.

We certainly can hope that the developers are smarter than this... but with daikaiju #235098 attacking the world, I have my doubts.

[Rob-Bert]

We'll know they're capable if said kaiju doesn't end up being the game's final frontier.

[Opa-Opa]

Argh. Just saw that video from Gamevideos and I think most of my expectations just went downhill. I can't stop noticing that the controls aren't helping the player at all there. There's a part where he's fighting some robots and he crashes in the wall four times in a row. That brings me bad memories of Sonic 06.

But the 2.5D parts look great. Damn game should be like that all the way.

[FlashTHD]

Argh. Just saw that video from Gamevideos and I think most of my expectations just went downhill. I can't stop noticing that the controls aren't helping the player at all there. There's a part where he's fighting some robots and he crashes in the wall four times in a row. That brings me bad memories of Sonic 06.

Watch the GameKyo one that's on Sonic Stadium's front page. Lots of annoying people standing in the way of the screen, but that person appears to know what the hell they're doing instead of looking like they're mashing buttons and flailing all over the place.

[DackAttac]

Argh. Just saw that video from Gamevideos and I think most of my expectations just went downhill. I can't stop noticing that the controls aren't helping the player at all there. There's a part where he's fighting some robots and he crashes in the wall four times in a row. That brings me bad memories of Sonic 06.

I'm pretty sure that was the "barrel down a straightaway and take out everything in your path" move when he was supposed to do a homing attack. Like I said earlier, I'm elated you can't solve all your problems in this game with that cheap maneuver.

[Dasher]

The homing looked smoother than ever though.

[DackAttac]

I didn't notice, but we could be looking at the first rail section that's not utterly cocked up.

[Dasher]

In my opinion the best rail system was that of SA2, it felt genuine as if you had to maneuver well or risk messing up.

Those last levels felt legendary with all those rails and stuff, specially Sonic's last level.

[Tsuyoshi-kun]

I didn't find Heroes' rail system too difficult at all, and I prefer it drastically over the one in Sonic Adventure 2. At least in Sonic Heroes you have a faint chance of saving your ass if you start to fall, a luxury one does not have in SA 2.

[Crazy Penguin]

The rail system kind of sucked in all of them, but I do like the idea so long as they're used in moderation, cleverly integrated into the scenery, always optional and you never have to switch rails over bottomless pits.

[DackAttac]

The rail system kind of sucked in all of them, but I do like the idea so long as they're used in moderation, cleverly integrated into the scenery, always optional and you never have to switch rails over bottomless pits.

Well, that's the thing, they'll probably never be truly optional, but as long as I have a way to switch them without falling off, (as foolproof as the triggers seems to be), I get the thrill of switching them over vast nothingness without the risk.

SA2 was good in practice; if you want to switch, you have to do it the hard way... unfortunately, it handled just as well as 3D Sonic over a bottomless pit should be expected to and resulted in a tad few too many wasted lives on the premise.

I forget was Heroes' was like, and would rather fire a nail gun up my ass than jog my memory. I seem to recall a lot of three-rails-one-per-character sections, though.

[Locit]

The rail system kind of sucked in all of them, but I do like the idea so long as they're used in moderation, cleverly integrated into the scenery, always optional and you never have to switch rails over bottomless pits.

Or do it right, like Ratchet and Clank.

[Senbei]

Really? I've found Ratchet and Clank's rail gameplay to be very, very dull. Grinding feels like a scripted event, where in SA2 you can control speed and balance, if somewhat clumsily, to create a truly fun experience. I'm pretty much in favor of Sonic-style grinding with the limitations that CP specified.

[Majestic Joey]

I've never liked grinding. It always took away from the running.

Another problem with grinding is it usually is always over a bottomless pit. It isn't this way just with Sonic but even with games like Psychonauts. I've never played the Ratchet and Clank games though.

[FlashTHD]

Really? I've found Ratchet and Clank's rail gameplay to be very, very dull. Grinding feels like a scripted event, where in SA2 you can control speed and balance, if somewhat clumsily, to create a truly fun experience. I'm pretty much in favor of Sonic-style grinding with the limitations that CP specified.

Truth. Something possessed me to like Shadow grinding the first time, but watching Unleashed for a while snapped me out of it - you're just whisked along, doing the bidding of the current Cool Camera Angle™ and they never show Sonic doing anything else on the rails besides switching them the "fail-proof flip" way. Bleck.

If it's within their ability to polish up SA2 grinding, more power to them. But heavens, leaving it up to the player to play most of the game again after our last intentional, increasingly bad foul ups of simple things like control stick sensitivity, why what a terrible thought!

I've never liked grinding. It always took away from the running.

Oh that sure says volumes.

(try again, dude?)

[Majestic Joey]

Look the thing I hate about grinding is that your stuck on a rail doing nothing pretty much. when you can run around you can move any direction and explore somewhat. grinding you just slide there and pretty much do nothing. I'd rather get from point A to point B with all sorts of complicated jumps than just sliding down a rail and lean left and right occasionally.

[gr4yJ4Y]

You know what game had the worst rail segments? Sonic Advance 1. I'm just saying...

[RocketPunch]

Look the thing I hate about grinding is that your stuck on a rail doing nothing pretty much. when you can run around you can move any direction and explore somewhat. grinding you just slide there and pretty much do nothing. I'd rather get from point A to point B with all sorts of complicated jumps than just sliding down a rail and lean left and right occasionally.

Agreed. I enjoyed the last two Sonic/Shadow levels in SA2 (Final Rush and Final Chase?) that were entirely dedicated to grinding--where rails became the dominant form of gameplay and your ability to maneuver through them affected your experience in the level itself--but I've only ever seen them as pointless interruptions in other levels, merely included to make Sonic seem more ~*extreme.