From Mii to Mii Friends

Team Mecha · Post by **Team Mecha** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 2:23 am

I have the Cube version & am quite enjoying it. The fact that I don't even get crosshairs when using the bow doesn't seem to bother me at all since I still shot a 2 pixel tall enemy on the first try. Besides, while I may be okay with Link being right handed, the idea of everyone else in the game being lefties drives me nuts.

I like how after the fourth dungeon, they made the most predictable aspect of the entire Zelda series into a plot twist. Nintendo did went overboard on the whole "more of the same" deal. You begin in a forest where the first dungeon is, the next dungeon is on Death Mountain after you go through the gorgon village & the third is in Lake Hylia after encountering a frozen Zora's Domain. Yeesh, talk about Deja Vu!

I think too many games are relying on the nunchuck, there needs to be more.....full games that require just the base controller. The fact that Super Mario Galaxy uses the nunchuck is a grave mistake IMO. Mario platformers are usually looked upon as the crowning examples of a system's potential. SMG should showcase what the remote can really do on its own along with Nintendo's intentions of changing the conventions of video games (streamlined simplicity without sacrificing gameplay).

Post by **Green Gibbon!** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 2:48 am

The nunchuck is essential. There's absolutely no efficient way to maneuver a character through a 3D environment with just that stick.

Post by **Segaholic2** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 3:11 am

Team Mecha wrote:SMG should showcase what the remote can really do on its own along with Nintendo's intentions of changing the conventions of video games (streamlined simplicity without sacrificing gameplay).

Except it can't.

That's right, I went there.

Post by **Esrever** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 3:39 am

The nunchuk is vital... not just for the joystick, but for the secondary motion sensor. It's what gives the Wii infinitely more potential than any previous motion-detecting device... you can move your hands independently of one another, and the system can track the movements of them both. Suddenly, the controller is not just an object you can tilt. It's an extension of your own hands.

The first game to really demonstrate a "revolution" will be a game that translates basic hand gestures directly into the hand gestures of your in-game character. I don't think Mario is going to be that game, although I'm sure it will be fun. It looks like Metroid Prime is scratching the surface of the idea, though. Wii Bowling does it as well -- and it's the only Wii Sports game that really does -- but it's limited by design because it's only one gesture. (And you can only get so excited about bowling.)

Post by **Green Gibbon!** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 4:04 pm

Hey, I unlocked the hot coffee minigame! With Epona.

Hybrid · Post by **Hybrid** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 6:21 pm

Unnecessary mirroring and no camera control aside, the thing that really bothers me about Zelda on the Wii is the on-screen item slots. Look at a screenshot of the Gamecube version: The five main buttons (A,B,X,Y,Z) are all neatly placed in the top right corner, stylised to look really Zelda-ish. On the Wii, it just looks ugly. There was obviously no attempt made to make them look good, they just got pictures of all the buttons and splashed them all across the right side of the screen. Never before has the item menu been so intrusive.

One complaint I've always found odd though is the fairy pointer. I never noticed it all, and the sound it makes is quiet enough to let you know its there, but not to get in the way. All that aside, it does actually have a use. If you're Z-Targeting something, and there's another enemy around, you can point the fairy at the other enemy and those three yellow targeting triangles will take the place of the fairy. Pressing Z again will lock you on to that enemy. I never found it useful, since enemies tend to group up right in front of you anyway, but at least it isn't a completely useless addition.

Zeta · Post by **Zeta** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 7:32 pm

ne complaint I've always found odd though is the fairy pointer. I never noticed it all,

I think the complaint is typically made by those who have very bad memories of Navi.

Baba O'Reily · Post by **Baba O'Reily** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 8:28 pm

I can see inputting the SM64 jump commands with the nunchuck. I can also see playing virtual drums with it, but that probably already occurred to all of you.

Team Mecha · Post by **Team Mecha** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 10:46 pm

If a control stick & a couple of extra buttons are really that needed, than I'd rather use a PS3 controller.

That's right, I went there.

Also, Yeto's a pedophile. No way I'm going to believe that a size difference that great is normal for his species.

Post by **Green Gibbon!** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 11:37 pm

If a control stick & a couple of extra buttons are really that needed, than I'd rather use a PS3 controller.

That's right, I went there.

Well, it's not like the PS3 has a bad controller. It's quite a relief that they chickened out of that boomerang nonsense. The Dual Shock is still the best traditional style joypad ever designed.

Post by **Esrever** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:21 pm

The fairy pointer is only annoying because it makes a whooshing sound whenever it moves. It never really bothers me when I play, but that's because I point the remote completely off screen whenever I'm not using it for aiming. (This is an important part of the awesome new "gaming slouch" position that seperate-handed controllers have ushered in.)

The only real reason it is there is so that you can keep track of where you're aiming even when you don't have a projectile weapon equipped. This is helpful later in the game when you have to take shots in a hurry, because you don't have to spend a second "finding" the aiming cursor every time you pull your bow (or whatever else) out.

Zeta · Post by **Zeta** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 3:05 pm

Also, Yeto's a pedophile. No way I'm going to believe that a size difference that great is normal for his species.

That did creep me the fuck out.

So did the Ooccoo. They just look WRONG.

Shadow Hog · Post by **Shadow Hog** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 3:30 pm

The Oocca. Ooccoo's the name of the one who acts like Farore's Wind.

Post by **Green Gibbon!** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 4:22 pm

I pooped myself when I found Obachan/Ooccoo. That shit's all Seaman weird.

Incidentally, the sword slashing mechanic has failed to grow on me. Both my thumb and my aching wrist long for a comforting action button - I keep instinctively pressing A to slash and end up rolling right into danger. Plus, the delay in screen detection makes timing unnecessarily difficult in twitch situations.

The game is good and the slingshot/bow mechanic is delightfully smooth, but otherwise, this seems like a hurried port. If I were to start over, I'd just get the Cube version, widescreen or no.

Shadow Hog · Post by **Shadow Hog** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 6:22 pm

Enough Wii games talk, more Wii Friend Codes, 'kay.

Mine's 7343 2177 0495 5898. I believe I've added everyone except CE, for who I get the same problem GG! did.

Zeta · Post by **Zeta** » Tue Jan 16, 2007 9:35 pm

I pooped myself when I found Obachan/Ooccoo. That shit's all Seaman weird.

If the plot threads Seaman left open had been made into a sequel, I imagine Seaman's girlfriend the Birdwoman would look pretty much exactly like Ooccoo.

Gaz · Post by **Gaz** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 11:41 am

My number:

0965 9545 6652 4804

Grant · Post by **Grant** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 9:06 pm

I'm a little frustrated that the Mii Parade doesn't reveal who created each individual mii, because my roommates and I equally love and fear the creepy Mr. Haniwa and the bumble bee girl. Who's are those?

Locit · Post by **Locit** » Sun Jan 21, 2007 11:37 pm

I haven't seen bumble bee girl, but I'm pretty sure Mr. Haniwa is by Gibbon. He has a thing for Haniwa pottery people. I think he's responsible for the Mii Cherry, which is awesome. The rest of you hop to. My Mii parade is pathetic.

Grant · Post by **Grant** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 12:30 am

Well, I have a bunch of miis that you'll be getting, Locit, but I guess none of them would be amusing unless you knew the people they're based on.

Post by **Green Gibbon!** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 1:17 am

Yep, I am responsible for Mr. Haniwa and Cherry. I was pretty pleased with how Cherry turned out.

Also, Twilight Princess is the best Zelda in years. It's much tighter than Wind Waker and in particular has much better level design and pacing. Nintendo has finally given us the logical evolution of Ocarina, which it one ups in every possible category except maybe music, and even that's good - it's a nice ambient score that suits the mood well, but it just doesn't stick with you. I have gotten used to the stick wiggling to the point that it becomes my instinctive attack motion and doesn't hurt my wrist so much, but except for the minigames and bow aiming, there isn't any real advantage over a normal control pad. As much as Nintendo emphasizes the Wii version, this is obviously a GameCube game and for the most part could be played just as well with a traditional controller on the Cube. But Cube or Wii, Twilight is essential playing.

Dash · Post by **Dash** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:54 am

My code is 0732 1817 7833 7540. I needs me some new Miis.

I'll agree that Twilight Princess is technically the best Zelda since OOT. The gameplay is insanely satisfying and every aspect of the design is top notch. However, I'm pretty disappointed that overall it's not as daring as the previous two 3D entries. Majora's Mask provided a twisted land that took the smaller aspects of OOT much further. People complained, but Wind Waker gave those people the proverbial middle finger by ditching the art style of the N64 games and taking gamers off the plains and into the sea. Both titles took us out of our comfort zone and (if you kept an open mind) were successful in showing how flexible the Zelda formula is.

In comparison to these, Twilight Princess seems rather conservative. It's like it was made in direct response to those who screamed "give me a realistic OOT-like Zelda!" when given the past couple wild takes on the franchise (which is laughable, because anyone who calls the art style of TP or the 64 games "realistic" is a moron. It is and has always been an animated affair.). I was hoping the Twilight Zone and Wolf Transformation would provide some funky plot twists and gameplay aspects later in the game and while my hopes weren't completely dashed it didn't feel like they took the concept far enough. It's still awesome-a definite step forward. In many ways though, this game feels a bit too familiar. It's sad to think that some people cried when this game was first announced.

That said, I am super content with the latest Zelda adventure. Though there is a distinct Deja vu to most of it, there are some very different dungeon designs throughout ( Yeto's Mansion, the Twilight Castle, and the Oocca Palace all spring to mind. ). The characters you get to know are enduring, but it's too bad there aren't more Majora's Mask style sidequests where you get to interact with them more. The ending is quite a shock in that you walk away feeling as though you haven't saved anyone. The evil of Ganondorf hasn't been fully vanquished, only put to rest for a while. At first I thought it was mistake, but seeing as only the Gods and spirits were aware that you were saving the world (and that later Hyrule will be washed away) it really is the only appropriate way to end things.

I bought the Wii version for motion features, so it's unfortunate to find they didn't use them much. I realize that it was not made to take advantage of Wii controls, but how awesome would it have been to sumo wrestle Gorons and toss goats with full motion control? Or stab downward for the final blow on an enemy you've knocked to the ground? It's not much, but considering I actually pretended these functions existed I think it might have made for a cooler experience. Anyway, I really enjoy the motion-based control and hope that when the N64 Zeldas are on VC they might include the option to use the Wiimote/Nunchuck (I know they won't, but still...).

So... play TP. It's quite good. Yeah.

Zeta · Post by **Zeta** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 10:52 am

On a related point to TP, did anyone else get the distinct feeling that the game was trying as hard as it could to hint that the Twili used to be the Gerudo?

Both titles took us out of our comfort zone and (if you kept an open mind) were successful in showing how flexible the Zelda formula is.

I had an open mind. It turns out that half hours of sailing across featureless water is incredibly boring, and feels suspiciously like artificial filler made to extend the gameplay longer.

Anyways, supposedly, the next Zelda game already comes out in a year. When they pushed back TP, they didn't stop working on the next installation. So the TRUE Wii Zelda with actually immersive controls is on it's way already.

The ending is quite a shock in that you walk away feeling as though you haven't saved anyone. The evil of Ganondorf hasn't been fully vanquished, only put to rest for a while.

That's what happens in almost every game, though. Ganondorf deserves credit for persistance, if nothing else. I know I would've quit after the third century of trying to ressurect myself, only to get smacked down by a kid in green longjohns.

Anyways, you know what? I've thought about where I'd like to see the series go. I think it's time a Zelda game was attempted that was set in an era outside of the middle ages. Quite frankly, Hyrule is on the verge of a industrial revolution. They've discovered the steam engine, industrialized mining (thanks to the Gorons), photography, and gunpowder as of TP and WW. The annoying thing about Middle-Earth, for instance, was that it was a civilization existing hundreds of thousands of years without technology.

Personally, I'd like the next Zelda to be set in a turn-of-the century 1900s Hyrule. If nothing else, it would prove to be a welcome depature and add a bit of nice continuity to the series. I think the midieval world setting needs a bit of a shakeup. And I would welcome the bizarre sight of seeing Gorons and Zoras drive around in Model Ts.

I know it seems like Final Fantasy's schtick, and I would certainly not want to set a prescedent for Cyberpunk Zelda or anything, but I think it's time the franchise stretched itself a bit.

Also, I'd like to see what the Rito look like in a more realistic artstyle. I thought those guys were cool . . .

Also, in terms of new direction, I would not mind a game where multiple playable characters was one of the main draws of the game. The character switching dungeons were my favorite parts of Wind Waker. I wouldn't want a Sonic Heroes or Four Swords-style set-up mind you. But more like a situation where Link recruits a new character to assist in each dungeon. Or maybe a situation where you have twin Links each with different items?

But really, what i want to see is just the return of the fucking sword beam!

Post by **Green Gibbon!** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 2:53 pm

The problem with Majora's Mask and Wind Waker is that neither one really worked. Majora was tightly weaved and quite clever, but the constant stopgap mechanic that the whole game was built around grew extremely tiresome. Wind Waker, on the other hand, was sloppily executed with huge chunks of tedium connecting some (mostly) sub-par dungeons (which is a shame, because a sailing adventure game is a great idea if anyone could ever do one the right way). Plus the "bold" art style was really pretty kitsch and forgettable. I'll thank Nintendo to never cel-shade any of their franchises ever again.

Frieza2000 · Post by **Frieza2000** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 3:41 pm

Green Gibbon! wrote:but except for the minigames and bow aiming, there isn't any real advantage over a normal control pad.

What's that about minigames? I'm still really torn about which version to get and something this trivial could tip the scales. The wii offers the possibility of downloadables and an unfamiliar control scheme to give the overly familiar experience some of the newness that OOT had, but the GCN offers that same familiarity as a sense of continuity and the fulfillment of all that came before. And if the resemblance to OOT's Hyrule is noticeable, I really don't want it to be backwards. Lake Hylia belongs on the <i>left</i>.