But life wouldn't be nearly as interesting if I ignored the people I don't agree with.Double-S- wrote:Seeing as Chris pops a boner for constant virtual guns and explosions (as long as they're real life accurate), I thought you'd know well enough to just ignore that opinion.
Sega Sammy's Doing Good
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chriscaffee
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So because I like guns my opinion on a game is invalid? I'm not really seeing the connection here. There are plenty of games I play that don't involve firearms. (Blinx) It's not my fault that the story behind the first game wasn't very interesting and the gameplay was even worse.Seeing as Chris pops a boner for constant virtual guns and explosions (as long as they're real life accurate), I thought you'd know well enough to just ignore that opinion.
The character had no character and the point of the game was to press "A" when it told me too. More like a chore. And my sense of accomplishment when I beat it... amounts to Ryo getting on a boat. Seriously. What happened to the whole revenge thing? Oh yeah, that's in the next game. The one you have to buy after this.
It's like buying the first chapter to a book. Not the first act or the first story in a series, but the first chapter. As a whole, it might be great, but the game feels like I'm playing a very long demo.
Pretty much, yeah. The majority of people who didn't like Shenmue are the ones who want nothing but gobs and gobs of action in their games and somehow just can't grasp the concept of Shenmue.chriscaffee wrote:So because I like guns my opinion on a game is invalid?
You probably just went straight through the game, straight from each story event to another, right? There's so much more depth to the game, both gameplay-wise and plot-wise, than that. And I'm not talking about simply collecting capsule toys or running into an optional scene. There's much more in Shenmue than any guidebook has listed.
Plus, you haven't played the second game. So it's even less valid.
Oh, by the way, GG!, that whole "explore every single room in Kowloon" thing <A HREF="http://dynamic4.gamespy.com/~shenmuedoj ... lding+raid" target="_blank">has been done</A>. Don't click if you still plan on actually ever doing it.
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chriscaffee
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<I>Pretty much, yeah. The majority of people who didn't like Shenmue are the ones who want nothing but gobs and gobs of action in their games and somehow just can't grasp the concept of Shenmue.</I>
Wait so do you have a statistic you can reference or something or is this some kind of baseless generalization? Even if it was true, you are using a stereotype to try and analyze my opinion. Not a good argument to take. Instead of trying to rationalize another's opinion, why don't you just ask them why it is case? Seems to make more sense to me, and if you pull the tired "I don't care anyway" argument, then why even bother with it in the first place?
<I>You probably just went straight through the game, straight from each story event to another, right? There's so much more depth to the game than that. Even more than any guidebook has listed.</I>
No, not on my first time through, but that was because I didn't know what the hell I was supposed to be doing, so I just went around talking to people and doing whatever. If you want to call that depth, fine, I see it as more of a distraction, but even so, I didn't rush through the game when I first played it. I'm sure I didn't do every side quest or whatever, but I certainly took some time with it.
<I>Plus, you haven't played the second game. So it's even less valid.</I>
Do I have to play MechWarrior 4 to like MechWarrior 3? What the fuck kind of bankrupt argument is that? I realize that Shenmue 2 is a continuation of the first, but if the first didn't interest me, what does 2 matter? Are you saying I have to take them both as one game? If that's the case, then your opinion is just as invalid because you haven't played the nonexistent Shenmue 3 which is part of it. If I can't make a valid judgment before completing the game, then neither can you.
Look, in my humble opinion MechWarrior 3 is as good as it gets. VOOT comes close, but MechWarrior 3 is pretty much the best gaming experience I have ever had. By your own logic, if you don't like guns, then your opinion on MW3 is instantly invalid. If you didn't find the story enjoyable, and don't know the aftermath of what happens in the BattleTech timeline, then your opinion is invalid. See how ludicrous this is? The BattleTech universe has infinitly more depth and much more literature then Shenmue could ever wish to have, but what the hell does that have to do with MechWarrior 3? You either like it or you don't. All that extra analysis is for fanboys, which is why it's irrelevant if you don't like it.
Wait so do you have a statistic you can reference or something or is this some kind of baseless generalization? Even if it was true, you are using a stereotype to try and analyze my opinion. Not a good argument to take. Instead of trying to rationalize another's opinion, why don't you just ask them why it is case? Seems to make more sense to me, and if you pull the tired "I don't care anyway" argument, then why even bother with it in the first place?
<I>You probably just went straight through the game, straight from each story event to another, right? There's so much more depth to the game than that. Even more than any guidebook has listed.</I>
No, not on my first time through, but that was because I didn't know what the hell I was supposed to be doing, so I just went around talking to people and doing whatever. If you want to call that depth, fine, I see it as more of a distraction, but even so, I didn't rush through the game when I first played it. I'm sure I didn't do every side quest or whatever, but I certainly took some time with it.
<I>Plus, you haven't played the second game. So it's even less valid.</I>
Do I have to play MechWarrior 4 to like MechWarrior 3? What the fuck kind of bankrupt argument is that? I realize that Shenmue 2 is a continuation of the first, but if the first didn't interest me, what does 2 matter? Are you saying I have to take them both as one game? If that's the case, then your opinion is just as invalid because you haven't played the nonexistent Shenmue 3 which is part of it. If I can't make a valid judgment before completing the game, then neither can you.
Look, in my humble opinion MechWarrior 3 is as good as it gets. VOOT comes close, but MechWarrior 3 is pretty much the best gaming experience I have ever had. By your own logic, if you don't like guns, then your opinion on MW3 is instantly invalid. If you didn't find the story enjoyable, and don't know the aftermath of what happens in the BattleTech timeline, then your opinion is invalid. See how ludicrous this is? The BattleTech universe has infinitly more depth and much more literature then Shenmue could ever wish to have, but what the hell does that have to do with MechWarrior 3? You either like it or you don't. All that extra analysis is for fanboys, which is why it's irrelevant if you don't like it.
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Green Gibbon!
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Erm... that's kind of the point of every game, isn't it?The character had no character and the point of the game was to press "A" when it told me too.
I'll be the first person to admit that I have a habit of giving Shenmue more credit than it probably deserves, but as naive as it is in terms of story and execution, it is still a baby step in a totally new direction, to say nothing of its beautiful art style and unconventional setting. The object of Shenmue is to stop, look, and explore... of course, its demands are well beyond the attention span of average joe gamer who just wants to blow shit up and call people obscene names over Xbox Live.
Certainly it didn't live up to its hype, but it is nonetheless drastically misunderstood, which is a genuine tragedy. It could be called a failure, but it's the best, most beautiful failure ever.
What? Because 9 out of 10 complaints of Shenmue I see are all "it's boring" or "not enough action". Which is not the point of Shenmue.chriscaffee wrote:Wait so do you have a statistic you can reference or something or is this some kind of baseless generalization? Even if it was true, you are using a stereotype to try and analyze my opinion. Not a good argument to take. Instead of trying to rationalize another's opinion, why don't you just ask them why it is case? Seems to make more sense to me, and if you pull the tired "I don't care anyway" argument, then why even bother with it in the first place?
Do you think people play MechWarrior for the story or for the blowing up of robots with robots? Which is more important to the essence of the game?Do I have to play MechWarrior 4 to like MechWarrior 3? What the fuck kind of bankrupt argument is that?
No, because Shenmue 2 is already out and available to be played and I'm talking about the Shenmue series as we know it from the two games. If I had the possibility of making a time machine and going into the future to play Shenmue 3 and I didn't, then making claims about the series as a whole would be stupid.I realize that Shenmue 2 is a continuation of the first, but if the first didn't interest me, what does 2 matter? Are you saying I have to take them both as one game? If that's the case, then your opinion is just as invalid because you haven't played the nonexistent Shenmue 3 which is part of it. If I can't make a valid judgment before completing the game, then neither can you.
If I disliked blowing stuff up in mechs with a fiery passion, then any opinion I formed on MechWarrior 3 would be ridiculous and completely useless, because I'd be missing the entire point of the game. Maybe not so far as "invalid", but would anyone take it seriously? No.Look, in my humble opinion MechWarrior 3 is as good as it gets. VOOT comes close, but MechWarrior 3 is pretty much the best gaming experience I have ever had. By your own logic, if you don't like guns, then your opinion on MW3 is instantly invalid.
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Baba O'Reily
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The object of Shenmue is to stop, look, and explore...
And to sort through piles of keys.
I actually loved both games, but at two points (the key bit and the tape recorder sequence) it got a bit tedious. I was especially frustrated when the correct recording turned out to be the last one, which meant resisting the temptation to skip ahead all that time because I might miss the message was totally pointless.
