Sonic Unleashed?

Recent happenings of pertinence to Sonic fans.
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Ngangbius
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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Ngangbius »

^So will the 360 version.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by P.P.A. »

MiraiTails wrote: Starting with Sonic Adventure, Sonic has become quite uncontrollable. I don't know why this is, but fix it. It was fine before then, why the hell has it gotten worse?
Fixed.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by MiraiTails »

Since the 360 date has been "broken" in so many places I think it's fair to say that it was supposed to be released now. Did Sega ever actually say 11/24? Monday's a very weird day to release a game here in the States.

Also, I paid $50 for my copy at Gamestop. I think that's the standard price for this game.
Last edited by MiraiTails on Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Locit »

P.P.A. wrote:
MiraiTails wrote: Starting with Sonic Adventure, Sonic has become quite uncontrollable. I don't know why this is, but fix it. It was fine before then, why the hell has it gotten worse?
Fixed.
Dude you are so weird.

The controls for Sonic in Wii Unleashed are surprisingly competent, and along with a full suite of Dimps-developed levels I think they could easily be a foundation for an extremely solid game.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Radrappy »

P.P.A. wrote:
MiraiTails wrote: Starting with Sonic Adventure, Sonic has become quite uncontrollable. I don't know why this is, but fix it. It was fine before then, why the hell has it gotten worse?
Fixed.
say a fucking word about how great Sonic 06 is. I fucking dare you

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Rob-Bert »

I played it recently. The only good thing about it was the level design. Everything else either had the potential to be good but got fucked up, or probably wouldn't have been good to begin with

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Baba O'Riley »

The game was mediocre. Not good, but not unplayable.

It's a long, long drought ahead.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by G.Silver »

Wow, just wow. I must agree with the "don't buy it" sentiment, but at the same time, you should still play it, because mere words can't convey what is wrong with this game. I could not have imagined a game as stupidly designed as this. I mean, I thought about it as I played it, but actually making a list of what's wrong or stupid in it would not really be worth anyone's time (unless they had the means to brandish it in front of the developer's face). It's as if, instead of making a game intended to be pleasing to play, the developers were handed a grotesque mandate of game-like "elements" to string together and hope that maybe something playable came out of it. They clearly have no idea what they're doing.

The 2D segments are unforgivable. It's like they thought Secret Rings was a good idea for 3D so maybe it was a good idea for 2D too? You can do it, but Sonic was clearly not meant to stop, or turn around. He doesn't skid to a halt, he slows down gradually and eventually turns around, and then sloooowly begins to move again in the opposite direction. What The Fuck.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Locit »

G.Silver wrote:Wow, just wow. I must agree with the "don't buy it" sentiment, but at the same time, you should still play it, because mere words can't convey what is wrong with this game.
Sorry to be the 17th person to ask, but, Wii or 360? Not that the sentiment doesn't apply to both.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by G.Silver »

Wii. Is the "village" just points on a map on the other versions?

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Locit »

No, which makes the prospect of slogging through the villages for the dialog trees in the 360 version sound ghastlier than a thousand ghouls!

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Ngangbius »

Someone at SA posted some specific differences between the Wii and 360 version:
For the sake of clarification, a compaison/list of differences between the Wii/PS2 and 360/PS3 versions:

HUBS

360 - there are two explorable, fully-rendered hubs for each continent, one that contains entrances to the levels and one that's full of NPC's. The level hubs contain a bit of platforming and require you to physically find entrances to some levels; the NPC hubs send you on fetch quests and whatnot which are required to service the story or reveal certain stages. Entirely tolerable, and not at all difficult, but they don't really add anything to the game.

Wii - same two hubs per continent, but they're static maps with icons rather than with new levels appearing once you complete certain NPC dialogue trees (static pictures with text boxes). There's so little point to the hubs in this version as they're not challenging or even that interesting; why they didn't just give you NPC cutscenes is beyond me.

DAYTIME/NIGHTTIME RATIO:

360 - About 50/50. Every continent has roughly three daytime levels and three nighttime levels, not counting bonus/secret stages, and you can skip many stages entirely (see "Medals" for more info)

Wii - harder to quantify. There's one full daytime level and three werehog level in every content, but there are also a bunch of Secret Rings/Rush Adventure-style challenges for each daytime level that give you different objectives. It does mean the ratio is closer to even (still skewed towards werehog) but many people are going to see it as a lazy substitute for more daytime levels, which is fair enough.

MEDALS:

360 - Medals come in Sun and Moon varieties and you need to have collected a certain amount of each before you can access later stages. These are scattered throughout the levels themselves and there are a lot of them, especially in the nighttime stages, so it's entirely possible to skip many nighttime stages entirely if you're thorough enough in the ones you do play. They can be frustrating to find in the daytime levels but the nighttime levels practically give them to you.

Wii - Medals are attained by completing levels with a high rank, based on time taken, enemies killed, rings collected etc. Removes exploration, but means that you'll have to play through the werehog levels to proceed.

DAYTIME GAMEPLAY

360 - Controls aren't perfect but are by no means bad, I'd put them on par with Adventure at least. Levels are longer than the Wii version and pull off some crazier architecture. Sonic gains experience at the end of every level which you use to buy/upgrade moves, so there'll be paths you can't reach without certain upgrades. Gaining experience isn't really that hard, but the whole concept seems unnecessary.

Wii - different, shorter levels but with the same general themes as the 360 ones. No grinding here, Sonic comes with all his moves from the beginning. Wiimote/Nunchuk controls are servicable but there's no real advantage to them over the pad.

NIGHTTIME GAMEPLAY:

Really, they're both very similar in terms of level length (too long), gameplay quality and even design. Total diet-Kratos stuff, nothing remarkable but at least it all works well. The werehog levels up in both versions, the difference being that in the 360 version you're given a choice as to which upgrades you get whereas the Wii version just gives you new moves as you gain experience. Wiimote controls for combat are fine but the platforming bits are a bit iffy.

MISCELLANEOUS:

360 - the cutscenes are rendered in-engine, so they're of the same graphic quality as the game. The hub has a few mini-games, such as one where you have to defend NPC's as the werehog, and there are between-continent minigames featuring Tails' plane that are nothing more than simple, pointless QTE's. I have noticed minor framerate issues in the nighttime sections and even the hub, but the daytime sections are fine.

Wii - cutscenes are videos taken from the 360 version. There are no Tails sections, the "Empire City" stage is completely missing and the African stage Mazuri is little more than a boss fight. No slowdown, but load times are an occasional nuisance.

My verdict: the Wii version is fun, the 360 version is better.
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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by CM August »

Just watched the final bosses and ending, thank you Youtube. To me, it kind of drives the point home that the entire premise of Unleashed is dogshit. The juxtaposition of its humorous, lighthearted and fun elements with a grim, portentous and dead-serious storyline is a nauseating combination. It's every cliche of modern Sonic game endings, but ramped up to an even higher degree. The game tries so hard to be epic it's laughable. And yes, for those curious about Eggman's role, take a look at SA1. My apologies if this post spoiled anything, but I'm pretty sure we all expected this.

Oh well. At least Chip was more than meets the eye! (canned laughter)

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by G.Silver »

"A world-size jigsaw puzzle?!"

These differences are amazingly arbitrary! Did they think that the response to leveling up in Secret Rings meant that Wii owners weren't going to take that crap again so they took it out/simplified it, while that annoyance remains fresh for 360/PS3 owners and maybe they'll like it? Is it to somehow balance out the length of the game? If there are 3 times as many daytime stages in the 360 version, why would they need to artificially lengthen the game?
Daytime: Controls aren't perfect but are by no means bad, I'd put them on par with Adventure at least.
Locit, do you agree with this? On the Wii, Sonic controls more like a tank, the Werehog has more in common with SA's basic gameplay than regular Sonic does.

On Wii, there is still an indoor "hub" with a variety of doors that open at various times (I guess?) and that's where you pick the action stages from, but as far as I can tell once unlocked all stages and "missions" become unlocked you can pick them from the world map directly. There are still NPC cutscenes in places in the Wii version for key events, such as rescuing "Professor Pickle."

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Hybrid »

The list of differences actually makes the 360 version sound tolerable! I'll give it a rent, then.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Dasher »

Meh..same here...only in Ps3 form.

in the mean time ill play other games.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Locit »

G.Silver wrote:
Daytime: Controls aren't perfect but are by no means bad, I'd put them on par with Adventure at least.
Locit, do you agree with this? On the Wii, Sonic controls more like a tank, the Werehog has more in common with SA's basic gameplay than regular Sonic does.
While I sort of enjoyed the Sonic levels, the controls were pretty far removed from typical 3D setup for the series. This is really obvious in the 2D areas, where Sonic takes a literal eon to simply turn around. In addition, instead of changing the boost to work like it did in Sonic Rush/Adventure for the 2D parts, it worked as it did in the 3D areas. This makes dashing extremely clunky and frustrating. Plus making a mistake in either perspective means slloooooowwwwwlllyyyyyy turning around and usually fighting the camera to regain control over where you go.

You literally have no camera control (even in werehog levels), and I think this stems from the fact that in 3D areas the camera dictates where the boost takes you. Using it will send you away from the screen at full speed regardless of the direction Sonic is pointed.

Throughout Unleashed I got the impression that Sonic Team was determined to force me to play as they thought any reasonable person should, as opposed to how any reasonable person would or could. Examples include: unskippable cutscenes, mandatory villager conversations and the entire final hour of the game.

It's a heavy handed and unforgiving game that doesn't look kindly on you trying to do anything that you're not supposed to, which is actually a pretty significant portion of what you can do. This might provide insight into exactly what Sonic team tries to do when making a game: they craft it with a specific audience in mind, and no one else. Their audience wants to watch cutscenes, enjoys talking to villagers, and thinks Chip is the bee's knees. That anyone could buy the game and think otherwise isn't possible.

I think this points to a huge disconnect between development and marketing/PR at Sega, at least in the case of Sonic Team. The fact that villages were kept under the radar (even after their existence was confirmed) shows that while other departments might realize what is attractive about a Sonic game, Sonic Team doesn't really have any idea. They seem particularly walled off from the rest of the company, perhaps due to their historical clout.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Shadow Hog »

I wonder if Sega is seriously considering nixing Sonic Team entirely and handing the franchise off to another internal developer? It's only what people seem to have been calling for for ages. I dunno if it'd actually fix anything, but...

Strangely, the 360 version is starting to sound pretty fun. I should probably rent that sucker.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

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Locit wrote:This might provide insight into exactly what Sonic team tries to do when making a game: they craft it with a specific audience in mind, and no one else. Their audience wants to watch cutscenes, enjoys talking to villagers, and thinks Chip is the bee's knees. That anyone could buy the game and think otherwise isn't possible.

I think this points to a huge disconnect between development and marketing/PR at Sega, at least in the case of Sonic Team. The fact that villages were kept under the radar (even after their existence was confirmed) shows that while other departments might realize what is attractive about a Sonic game, Sonic Team doesn't really have any idea. They seem particularly walled off from the rest of the company, perhaps due to their historical clout.
To be on the safer side of skepticism, I take it you had the will to finish it? Could you check the credits to see if there's any interesting clues in there? Ex.: godawful human beings like Shun Nakamura, other studio names credited for grunt work, game engines and et al. Anything in there that looks like it means something, would be good to know.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Locit »

FlashTHD wrote:To be on the safer side of skepticism, I take it you had the will to finish it? Could you check the credits to see if there's any interesting clues in there?
I did, but I'm not really keen to beat/play/look at it again for a while. The credit roll was actually the only thing you could skip, which is sort of baffling.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Baba O'Riley »

Locit wrote:
FlashTHD wrote:To be on the safer side of skepticism, I take it you had the will to finish it? Could you check the credits to see if there's any interesting clues in there?
I did, but I'm not really keen to beat/play/look at it again for a while. The credit roll was actually the only thing you could skip, which is sort of baffling.
God forbid people should have to read nonessential information in a video game. Sonic Team is looking out for you, the consumer.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by FlashTHD »

Locit wrote:
FlashTHD wrote:To be on the safer side of skepticism, I take it you had the will to finish it? Could you check the credits to see if there's any interesting clues in there?
I did, but I'm not really keen to beat/play/look at it again for a while. The credit roll was actually the only thing you could skip, which is sort of baffling.
Ok, consider it a mission from God.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Locit »

FlashTHD wrote:Ok, consider it a mission from God.
You have fun on that quest, then.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Ngangbius »

Shadow Hog wrote:I wonder if Sega is seriously considering nixing Sonic Team entirely and handing the franchise off to another internal developer? It's only what people seem to have been calling for for ages. I dunno if it'd actually fix anything, but...
I could only see that happening if the game doesn't meet their sales expectations.

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Re: Sonic Unleashed?

Post by Hybrid »

Didn't Sonic '06 sell like the remarkable pile of shit that it was? I seem to remember it being chuckled about here soon after the game's release.

I watched the final battle/cutscenes of the Wii version of Youtube. Looks terrible.

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