"Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

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Ritz
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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Ritz »

Dr. Watson wrote:Just use Omegas Beam Canon over and over again. Its the by far best attack in the game
You're totally thinking of Big's Battering Ram.

But yeah, Beam Cannon's a doozy, and I guess Tails' Scan is useful if you've got it fully levelled (Why would you, though?), but I'm thinking the most effective team here is Knuckles, Shadow and the obligatory Cream. Aside from their basic single-enemy armor piercing techniques, Shadow/Sonic's Atomic Blast and Knuckles/Shadow's Knuckles Express* will make relatively short work of everything in one fell swoop. You probably won't need Shadow again after this, so just grin and bear it!

*Someone should draw Knuckles conducting Thomas the Tank Engine and plowing through a mass of Marauders with Shadow standing on the booth, doing the "wryyy" thing. The image would also bear the caption, "Choo choo it's Knuckles." Seriously, someone do this for me.

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Arcade »

If you wont buy a Ds for this game, then buy it for Sonic Rush adventure, sure is a bit short, but getting Rank A in everything takes a lot of effort, I don't even know if the game has rank S like Sonic Rush.

PS: I know this is really old but there is any cheat to easy beat the giant robot in Sonic Rush, I tried everything, but it always kills me well It only has one energy bar left!

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Xyton »

So what level were you guys at the end of the game? I'm heading into the chapter before last, and I'm level 13. I'm not having any trouble, but....

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Owen Axel
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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Owen Axel »

You shouldn't have any trouble at all beating the game at level 15. Might need to use one of those heal-entire-party items, like, once.

Incidentally, Sonic Rush Adventure does indeed have S-ranks. They're just as damn near impossible to get as was the case in the first Rush. Shame, too. With the amount of "treasure" you get from S-ranks, you might just barely scrape by without having to replay competed levels, which was tedious.

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Neo »

Wow, you guys suck at Sonic Rush. :D

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by FlashTHD »

In the first one i've S'd all but four acts. Three that were too tough for me, and one I will never attempt to get so that, on Dead Line's act select, it reads ASS.

That just so happens, to be my favorite thing in the game. the ranks not the horrid stage

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Xyton »

So I just beat this sucker, and want to share some thoughts.
  • The ending. wat. I argree with Hybrid: "LOOK, STUFF IS HAPPENING the end."
  • They did the credits in an interesting way…
  • I think it's kinda sad that the music on a DS doesn't sound as good a Genesis. :P
Iono. Not terrible, but… Mario RPG came out on Virtual Console not too long ago, and playing it again, I noticed now much like a traditional Mario game it feels like / plays like at times -- it really feels like a Mario game. I don't think this feels so much like a Sonic game. Then again, I don't know how you'd make an RPG that feels like a Sonic game, but…. There are good ideas in there, but they seem buried. (I suppose you could say that about most of the Sonic games that have come out in recent year, though. @_@)

It's not terrible, though. I'll probably end up playing the sequel.

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Hybrid »

I think it could have felt more like a Sonic game if they'd actually tried to make it like a Sonic game. I mean, why does Sonic move so slowly? Why does every "interesting" action in the overworld (running through a loop, rolling a down a hill etc) require no input from you other than an initial button press? Why is every puzzle separated from travelling and - perhaps more pressingly - why are all the puzzles "Push buttons in the correct order" rather than puzzles integrated into the environment, like the "puzzles" you'd find in the Genesis games (Time your jumps over moving platforms, run fast over the top of water or risk sinking underneathe to the "hard" path, and so on). It doesn't feel like a Sonic game because nothing that makes a Sonic game is present in Chronicles other than Sonic himself.

Come to think of it... I think the game would be better as a 2D platformer. It'd still have turn-based battles (imagine like, in Sonic 1, running into a Crabmeat and instead of dropping rings, you get drawn into a battle with the Crabmeat), but it could have all the platforming goodness we associate with the series. The levels wouldn't even need to be the straight A-to-B sort we usually get, they could be set out more elaborately so the emphasis is still on exploring them rather than just blasting through them.

Not saying that that would be better than an actual 2D platformer, but it would definitely be more Sonic-y (and more inventive) than Sonic Chronicles.

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Rob-Bert »

I once proposed an idea similar to that. It was basically Sonic Adventure but with seperate battle screens added in when you run into an enemy. Said battle system worked more like Sonic Battle than a standard turn based RPG. Nobody liked it. :'(

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by G.Silver »

Anytime Sega and Nintendo want to team up and make Paper Sonic, I will be all over it.

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Frieza2000 »

You don't even need turn based battles. Just make an open ended Sonic game composed of a network of platforming areas with multiple exits. You'd have the obligatory town areas where you could buy things (upgrades, moves, lives, items, ammo) using rings or rank points, or you could even use some other currency and let the player buy rings (if they're being used as health and you only lose a few when you get hit). You could even have exp and stats if you really wanted. In other words, Tails Adventure with more features, a richer map, and plot development. Or, for a 3d version, look to the prototype of Jazz Jackrabbit 3.

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Locit »

Frieza2000 wrote:Metroidvania Sonic
Good idea!

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Rob-Bert »

Haven't we discussed the prospect of that before?

I recently got back to pondering my "Sonic Adventure meets Sonic Battle" idea, but the biggest problem is having a control scheme that stays the same throughout the game, and thus caters itself to both platforming and fighting. How would it work?

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Arcade »

One thing that anyoys me a lot about both Rush games, is that they give you extra moves for the stages, but you cant use them in Boss battles. In the Genesis games, you could use things like the fire shield in boss battles, It just was hard to arrive to the boss battle without the shield being destroyed.

Ps: In the first rush, is really easy to get S rank, just change the dificulty to easy, dah!

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Neo »

I just got all the S-Ranks I was missing (around ten or so) in Sonic Rush Adventure in about 30 minutes. They're piss easy.

It's the boss battles that are a bitch, though, because more often than not you need to finish them with every single ring available in hand.

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Ngangbius »

So I just beat this game over the weekend, and if I was going to describe this game in one word, it would be underwhelming.

Seriously, I have no motivation to try New Game+ because the game is too easy, too short, more more linear than more JRPGs, and ends at an abrupt point that makes it feels unfinshed. I'm glad I rented this game, because it really does feel like a rip-off.

Also, I too would also be in favor of Intelligent Systems of making a Sonic RPG. Despite being slightly disappointed in Super Paper Mario, they would probably pull off a better Sonic RPG than Bioware's Handheld team try to do. Hell, they outdid Square in their prime.

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Rob-Bert »

If they really are dead set on making a sequel, there's a good chance it'll end up being better than their first outing, is there not?

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Owen Axel »

Well, when Bioware ported Mass Effect to PC, they did listen well enough to fix a few of the more irritating drawbacks of the game (like that goddamned elevator). At least they have the amazing superhuman ability to listen to feedback and fix the parts people complain about, instead of throwing away any good aspects they stumble upon and then dragging another brand new half-retarded gimmick into the mix like a certain other game company I might name.

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Ngangbius »

I want to elaborate my problems with this game and why it is far from a "9" like 1up/EGM says it is or even an "8". And boy this post is a doozy!

--The art design is inconsistant in quality. When I mean art design, I mean the visuals as a whole--2D, 3D models, etc. The overworld backgrounds and chapter title cards are great. There were some really nice touches in detail work in Metropolis, especially with the Genesis reference. The character and item illustrations are decent. However, the 3D models are terrible, and it is not because of the DS. They are just pretty ugly looking--the CGI cutscreens, battle backgrounds, some enemies, and especially the PC/NPC characters. Bioware should have went with 2D art all the way. Then again, the comic-like cutscene illustrations also look terrible. Why are we not getting the same high quality of art that was found in the chapter title bumps when it could really benefited those cutscenes also?

--The sound as a whole is awful. From all the impressions I've read of this game before I had a chance to play it, this complaint is the most common. I mean, I have yet to encounter a person who likes the music in this game, as the quality of the soundtrack and the weird usage of sound effects are really bad as they said they were. It is also not the fault of the DS because this, this and this an examples what the DS are able to produce. The only music that is actually decent are the battle themes as it actually sound multiple instuments were used along with a good sense of composition, as opposed to the dinky, 1 to 2 midi sound effects that are poorly composed renditions of some previous Sonic themes and orignal themes. They is really a huge discrepancy in quality between the battle themes and the rest of the music. It's as if the battle themes were the first music to be composed and tuned up and the rushed the rest of the music. The sound effects are also random. It's like they picked up the weirdest assortment of them from some cartoon sound effect collection and slapped them at some odd places such as using growling sounds for some enemy robots or turkey gobbling sounds for other enemies. It's just many of them are so out of place and it makes the game unintentionally funny at times.

--Certain aspects of the game mechanics are undefined or broken. This goes beyond the battle system. I'm refering to the leveling system, the status screen, the interface, etc. The leveling system is borked. At first, I thought it was a limiting leveling system that was similar to Lost Odyssey and the Suikoden games in which your characters gain less and less exp. the stronger your characters get in a effort to force the player to avoid grinding. It seems like that early on in the game, however you get an extremely ridiculous amount of experience points in the second half of the game compared to the first, so much that it is easier to gain several levels and to become overleveled in the later half of the game. I never felt the need to grind in this game since it was very easy, and I still felt too overpowered(and it became apparent at the last boss fights).

Aspects of the interface is also messed up such as not telling which item or attack gives to which effects to characters/enemies during battles. I mean it is very annoying trying to remember the effects/elemental properties/etc of 100+ items/POW moves during a battle in which there are certain moves that maybe to your advantage. Also, what is with battles when they tell you when the order your characters go, but not the enemy? There is a loss stategy aspect there.

About stats, the Attack and Defense stats were really confusing as it really should have labeled as Hit rate and Evasion respectively. There isn't anything that tells you how how much damage and defense your character has except for a vague description found in the characters' codex entry. Some may find that cute, I find it to be lazy and cheap programing. It's also annoying when I attempt to buy shoes and gloves for my characters. You don't know how strong this equipment is beyond the abstract "slight, moderate, and great" labels. So it's confusing when stores late in the game sells equipment that does slight damage or gives you slight protection. Why are stores selling you seemingly weak armor in the game and at a high price? Or is it not that weak, just weak compared to the other items in that particular store, and it is actually stronger than the moderate armor that was sold in a store or found in a treasure chest several chapters ago? Who knows, and it is probably the main reason why people complain that they are doing single digit damage to enemies or missing them completely. The game needs defined numbers for damage and attack for items and characters just like in the vast majority of RPGs.

--This game is ultra-linear and the atmosphere at times feels un-Sonic-like. Now, I've played a lot of JRPGs and many of them and not as open-ended as say...Oblivion. They usually has a set path to get to point A and B and that's fine. However, they also have diversions from the main game in the form of sidequests such as optional towns, extra dungeons, and bosses with the reward of an extra cutscene or two and mad loot. Sonic RPG hardly has this. I mean the secrets of this game is very scarce. There are no extra dungeons, and I've encoutered only one optional boss in this game. And the game is very linear to the point that there are several "points of no return" for this game so any exploration aspect or skill usage in this title isn't as fully realised as it should be.

As for the part that it feels un-Sonic like, well it does. Expecting to fight off classic enemies like Moto Bugs, Buzzbomers, or Crabmeats in a RPG setting? Too bad! You are fighting off generic animals, non-animal generic robots, and aliens! =D Yes there are aliens--that don't fit in a good Sonic motif, and are better used for an original RPG. This game feels even less Sonic than Super Mario RPG felt less classic Mario-ish. I should also say the atmosphere feels empty. Bioware created these nice backdrops and yet there are hardly any interaction with the NPCs, because there are hardly any NPCs there. I was hoping something like Central City to be more populous.

--This game in general feels abrupt and rushed. "What, that's it!?" Is what I exclaimed after I beat the game. I do remember reading a post on neogaf saying that it must be the ending you get if you play the ROM, which is a programing techinique enabled developers to put in nastly little things such as data erasure at the final boss in a pirated copy of Earthbound or only allowing the first hour of gameplay and reseting the game as found in a pirated copy of FF Crystal Chronicles :Ring of Fates--all is done to discourage piracy. But no, the retail copy has an abrupt ending and instead just of filling plot holes from previous games like Bioware said it would, it only creates new questions like many recent Sonic games' terrible plots. The ending is on the level of those Congratulations! screen at the end of those old-school arcade games from the early 80s', but this is like a "SCREW YOU!" and a punch to the face because I just played a RPG from 2008!

--At least the dialogue is good... Well, they made the characters really likeable or at least tolerable, and it is funny especially when you answer with the snarky response. However, again it seems unrealized such as there is no real game directed outcomes such as multiple endings or different development between characters. For example, Tales of Symphonia has a very basic character development system that you as Lloyd, reply to your allies responses that affects their relationship with Lloyd giving the characters various dialogue at the end of each battle. It also ultimately affects the ending of the game. Star Ocean 2 had something similar to that, and in addition the more any of you characters bond with another ally, that all will get a power boost when his or her bonded character falls in battle. Unfortunately this game doesn't have that. For example, even though I tell Tails to stop asking me to save the game, he doesn't stop, and he is not hesistantly telling me to save it even. It's just a missed opportunity here. I also would have like more interactions between different characters other than Sonic or without having Sonic being the center of discussions.

--The touch screen controls are...okay. I have to say that it hasn't surprassed or even matched the touch screen controls found in LoZ:Phantom Hourglass. I mean it is not bad, but they could be better. Maybe a small cursor such as the fairy in PH would solve some of the problem. Though having your character move and then touching an icon to do a certain action makes it feel cumblesome. This is somewhat solved with using the L or R buttons instead, but it is not as seemless as it should be. The battle touch scrren controls are passable, although there have been occasions where moves failed to register on my DS despite touching the screen. Speaking of battles, I'm not sure if this Ouendan/EBA system should be the way to got for a Sonic-based RPG. I guess it is not as bad as a straight up turn-based battle system without any timed attacks, but I was expecting something a little more...action-ly for Sonic.

Wow that was long! As you can see most of the bigger problems of the game has to do with the overall presentation which rushing a title and implimenting odd design choices can really screw up a game from becoming a classic. I mean I expected more quality from a supposedly premiere developer who are charging a premium price for this game, and yet, I see two remakes of 15+ year old RPGs on the DS programmed from outsourced parties that looks much more professional than Sonic Chronicles.

tl;dr: Balls were dropped, game is rushed, abritrary scores of 6 and 7's are about right, disappointmenton!
Owen Axel wrote:Well, when Bioware ported Mass Effect to PC, they did listen well enough to fix a few of the more irritating drawbacks of the game (like that goddamned elevator). At least they have the amazing superhuman ability to listen to feedback and fix the parts people complain about, instead of throwing away any good aspects they stumble upon and then dragging another brand new half-retarded gimmick into the mix like a certain other game company I might name.
So if I sign up on their boards, and post this response I won't be greeted by flames from the Sonic fandumb and Bioware knob-slobbers?

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Owen Axel
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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Owen Axel »

Ngangbius wrote:
Owen Axel wrote:Well, when Bioware ported Mass Effect to PC, they did listen well enough to fix a few of the more irritating drawbacks of the game (like that goddamned elevator). At least they have the amazing superhuman ability to listen to feedback and fix the parts people complain about, instead of throwing away any good aspects they stumble upon and then dragging another brand new half-retarded gimmick into the mix like a certain other game company I might name.
So if I sign up on their boards, and post this response I won't be greeted by flames from the Sonic fandumb and Bioware knob-slobbers?
I don't see the connection between mildly competent game makers and whether or not their fans are...whatever the heck a knob-slobber is.

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Ngangbius
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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Ngangbius »

Well, I've heard that some Bioware devs and/or PR people visit the message board. Though I'm not sure that it is true or not.

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Owen Axel
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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Owen Axel »

Oh? Then I say by all means go there and post if you like. If the main branch of Bioware gets the idea that their handheld group isn't quite cutting it, then they'd be likely to step in and try to fix things for the better. In fact, a critical look at the credits seems to suggest that that's exactly what happened.

I recently downloaded and completed Jade Empire. The net result was that I've got a smidgeon of faith in Bioware. They're no Blizzard, but I get the feeling that they've got enough professional pride that they could be.

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by DackAttac »

I've been playing this game in infrequent, long bursts. I've been enjoying it, though I agree it's far from the perfection most have been claiming it to be. But it's pretty solid. Unfortunately, I don't save my game until I'm done with it for the time being, so I just lost five hours' worth of progress when it crashed. Yes, crashed. I'll probably end up neglecting it for a few months out of disinterest in repeating what I've just done. I mean, honestly, that's just bullshit. Console and handheld games are not supposed to crash.

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Xyton
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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by Xyton »

o_O Did your DS overheat or something?

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Re: "Sonic Chronicles" trademarked by Sega

Post by DackAttac »

Maybe crash isn't the right word. Froze up. It was like objects were placed in the incorrect areas and the game "couldn't compute" or something, and it was the end of the line. But yeah. Fucked up.

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