Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

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Dr. BUGMAN
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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Dr. BUGMAN »

Yeah, when I first say the Werehog I though "Huh, Sonic goes Runaway Brain," which is my favorite Mickey Mouse anything. You can go dark and have fun with it, guys (just maintain a modicum of perspective)! That said though, in the tug-o'-war of design complementing function, the former did in no way justify the latter.

Like, I hated Shadow going Fiddy Cent, but I totally don't mind Fang's popgun or Eggrobo's laser rifle. I guess it's a matter of verisimilitude?

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by M.C.Dillinger »

Sonic Lost World looks like Sega read my mind and did have of what I wanted them to do! I've always wanted a parkour sonic game but . . . the deadly six look stupid. I restart it funny to force sonic and egg Man to work together but I know they're squander this opportunity. Also, I'm getting a Mario vibe from the look of this game. There's something about Mario in my Sonic that I don't like. . .

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Radrappy »

M.C.Dillinger wrote:There's something about Mario in my Sonic that I don't like. . .
I hope its the part of mario that consistently yields amazing games. This is a franchise that surely could benefit from selling some of its soul for quality that's for sure.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Rob-Bert »

Dr. BUGMAN wrote:Yeah, when I first say the Werehog I though "Huh, Sonic goes Runaway Brain," which is my favorite Mickey Mouse anything. You can go dark and have fun with it, guys (just maintain a modicum of perspective)! That said though, in the tug-o'-war of design complementing function, the former did in no way justify the latter.

Like, I hated Shadow going Fiddy Cent, but I totally don't mind Fang's popgun or Eggrobo's laser rifle. I guess it's a matter of verisimilitude?
Thing about the Werehog is that it wasn't really "dark". The whole thing was treated like an episode of AoStH.

The only thing I didn't like about was the fact that you were essentially forced to play a climb-y, jumpy, beat-em-up in what was supposed to be a new Sonic game, and the climb-y, jumpy beat-em-up in question wasn't even that bad. If it were a standalone spin-off game, I'd probably like it a lot more.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Esrever »

Yeah. I like the design of the Werehog. It's really fun and cartoony, rather than another painful attempt to look cool, dark, or badass. I didn't like the gameplay he was attached to at all, though. I like beat-em-ups, and I like climbing/scaling-driven platform games, but I didn't think it was a very good take on either of those things.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Rob-Bert »

Part of the reason for its mediocrity is because they were forced to spread development time and resources between it and the main game. This is the problem that plagued '06 and both Sonic Adventures - It's not that the extra gameplay was inherently bad, it's that they were in essence forced to develop 3-6 games at once rather than focusing on the main event.

Had they given Eggman his own separate game based on those shooting stages, I'm sure it'd have turned out pretty kickass. Same thing with the telekinesis nonsense that Silver had going on. That's a fit premise for an original property of some sort.
Last edited by Rob-Bert on Wed Jun 05, 2013 9:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Neo »

Call me old, but I never got past the first Werehog level in Unleashed. There's that big guy that shows up and I tried pounding on him repeatedly until he died, but it never worked and I figured I had to use combos or some shit and that's not Sonic and I turned the game off and never played it again.

So don't give me shit about being able to "overlook" Werehog or some shit. I actually wanted to see what the fuss was about with Eggmanland and its half-hour long acts but the game never let me.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Radrappy »

That is a bit old sounding.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Dr. BUGMAN »

Rob-Bert wrote:Thing about the Werehog is that it wasn't really "dark". The whole thing was treated like an episode of AoStH.
I figured "dark" alone was pretty innocuous since it's so often paired with edgy/moody/gritty/etc. Like, how Nightmare Before Christmas is dark? Maybe it's "Macabre", I dunno. Anyway, the Werehog fits that milieu, and there's nothing wrong with that. Halloween's for everyone. Runaway Brain freaked me out when I first saw it at 7-8, but in the fun way.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Popcorn »

I don't get the werehog thing. I never played Unleashed, but regardless of the quality of the design or whatever, why would you want Sonic the Hedgehog to be a werewolf now? It plays to none of the franchise's strengths.

I'm not interested in Sonic doing anything new. Or Zelda. Or Mario. Or any other old franchise. You just want the franchise to master a few key, defining ideas, then stop making them, because it's finished.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Majestic Joey »

this is just a theory I have made up and have nothing to back these claims; I always wondered if the Werehog started out as a gameplay design for a 3d Ristar. I mean c'mon, stretchy arms and gameplay that does not fit in with a sonic game. I believe Silver's gameplay in Sonic 06 was originally made for an entirely different game but I'm not sure of that either.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Crisis »

The Werehog was not at the same level of stroke-inducing stupidity as Shadow, but it was still totally out of place and cause for any rational person to raise serious questions about how it could have been green-lit.
I'm not interested in Sonic doing anything new. Or Zelda. Or Mario. Or any other old franchise. You just want the franchise to master a few key, defining ideas, then stop making them, because it's finished.
Now that doesn't sound like good capitalism.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Wombatwarlord777 »

I liked the Werehog myself, both in design and gameplay terms. Actually, I almost liked the whole Werehog experience more than that of Daytime Sonic, because the mechanics and level design for that element of the game weren't quite refined to the level that they would in Colors and Generations. At least as the Werehog I didn't have to worry about falling into oblivion all the time (with the exception of Skyscraper Scamper. Seriously, fuck that level).

The one thing I didn't like about the Werehog gameplay was that doing so was required to progress through the story and play more Daytime stages. If they had made it like in Adventure 1 where you could ignore or play certain types of gameplay to your heart's content, I think the game would've been better received.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Rob-Bert »

Except you can't ignore the extra gameplay in SA1 because in order to unlock Super Sonic and thus see the ending you have to beat the game with everybody.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by G.Silver »

Sure you can. Who said you had to see the ending?

More importantly, you can explore all the different game modes at your own pace. You don't have to go fishing just because you wanted to see the next Sonic level. You can come back to fishing when you feel like it, push through it, and never do it again.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Wombatwarlord777 »

I suppose I should have clarified that I kind of disliked the Super Sonic story segment of the first Adventure game, because it's essentially just one more boss stage / action stage for Sonic to go through. While it's not bad (at the very least it incorporates how Sonic regularly moves in the game, as opposed to SA2's totally new controls as you try to awkwardly weave through space), it's not worth it to play through the entirety of Big's story in order to unlock it. I'd rather spend my time replaying the game's ten substantial and fun Sonic stages, which it fortunately allows me to do.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by G.Silver »

I have to agree! I logged so many hours playing Sonic's levels in trial mode, but I probably only did the Super Sonic level two or three times. It was a cool end-of-story event but it, like the other gameplay modes, was a neat add-on (speaking generously in some cases) but not even close to what I kept turning the game on for.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Gaz »

Gameplay video with commentary on IGN

It shows the 3 levels that will be playable at E3. I really like what I'm seeing. It has a Mario Galaxy-vibe but that's not a bad thing to me. It looks quite imaginative and I'm glad they're trying something a bit different with the gameplay rather than just rehashing the same formula they used for the last few games.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by P.P.A. »

Gameplay video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7nweiUGh-g
I was not expecting much, but I am still underwhelmed.
The pacing of the first stage seems erratic, copying Super Mario Galaxy's dreadful approach of segmenting the stage into little planetoids. You are railroaded by speed boosters, then shot around by cannons or springs, walk along a straight path, are shot about again… It does not look fun to play because you cannot settle into a playing style.
The second stage shown is mostly 2.5D, in which you run along a thin and narrow path, approaching apparently fun but ultimately generic platforming sections along the way. Consisting of… candy suspended a void, the level would look nothing like a Sonic game, were it not for the (awfully abundant) rings, and the oh-so nostalgic badniks from Sonic 1 and Sonic CD. The SEGA spokesman in the video is altogether eager to point out the soulless insertion of references to past games, like hidden capsules with animal friends, familiar badniks, or red rings (which Sonic fans will remember from Sonic Colors)!
Nonetheless, I was not prepared for the third stage shown to be a full-blown runner. Sonic accelerates automatically; you have to dodge obstacles and attack enemies, which you seem to be able to chain by the dozens with a single homing attack.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Gaz »

They also have some gameplay videos of the 3DS version as well.

The 3DS version looks surprisingly good. Apparently DIMPS are developing it.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by b_boult »

Is it just me or are the 90 degree turns at running pace rather awkward looking?

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by G.Silver »

It's probably just from there not being people talking over it, but the 3DS clips look a lot more fun to me. I really like the "planetoid" segments, they look like places I actually want to run around and jump on and stuff, and when they take a specific route I can already feel myself going "wait, what's down there? What if you go over here?" The 2D sections, especially that candy-themed level, has the weakness of being completely abstract, there are some fun ideas in there (like bouncing on the truffles) but without any sense of "place" it doesn't really seem compelling to me. I think I might also just not be interested in 2D Sonic anymore, the "3D problem" is just so much more interesting conceptually.

It's really interesting that they HAVE done a lot of the stuff we were talking about in the other thread, like slowing Sonic down, adding multiple paths, and if they didn't get an "outsider" perspective on it, it sure looks like they did, basically throwing out everything and starting from scratch. It looks a lot more "solid" from a purely mechanical standpoint and I think that's a great step forward.

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by FlashTHD »

P.P.A. wrote:Gameplay video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7nweiUGh-g
I was not expecting much, but I am still underwhelmed.
The pacing of the first stage seems erratic, copying Super Mario Galaxy's dreadful approach of segmenting the stage into little planetoids. You are railroaded by speed boosters, then shot around by cannons or springs, walk along a straight path, are shot about again… It does not look fun to play because you cannot settle into a playing style.
The second stage shown is mostly 2.5D, in which you run along a thin and narrow path, approaching apparently fun but ultimately generic platforming sections along the way. Consisting of… candy suspended a void, the level would look nothing like a Sonic game, were it not for the (awfully abundant) rings, and the oh-so nostalgic badniks from Sonic 1 and Sonic CD. The SEGA spokesman in the video is altogether eager to point out the soulless insertion of references to past games, like hidden capsules with animal friends, familiar badniks, or red rings (which Sonic fans will remember from Sonic Colors)!
Nonetheless, I was not prepared for the third stage shown to be a full-blown runner. Sonic accelerates automatically; you have to dodge obstacles and attack enemies, which you seem to be able to chain by the dozens with a single homing attack.
Ye gods, no kidding. They're not even trying to be subtle about what they're ripping off. It's got the goddamn 2D Mario level timer and everything.

Esrever, I could be imagining it, but didn't you say something once about Iizuka being sore that he didn't come up with Mario 64 first?

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by big_smile »

I really like the thinking behind the control system, the focus on exploration and secret paths and the return of all those classic references. It's almost like they read our Sonic Excursion thread.

The only thing I am not keen on is the level design. All those different dimensions seemed confusing and, as PPA notes, the second stage seemed very genric and bland.
Edit: G.Silver beat me to it!

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Re: Sonic Lost World - Nintendo Exclusive

Post by Crazy Penguin »

The 3DS version looks surprisingly decent, but it could really benefit from zooming the camera out on the 2D sections.
G.Silver wrote:IThe 2D sections, especially that candy-themed level, has the weakness of being completely abstract, there are some fun ideas in there (like bouncing on the truffles) but without any sense of "place" it doesn't really seem compelling to me.
I hate "everything is made of X" stages in platformers, they're insipid and lazy. I'm actually rather impressed with the Castle of Illusion remake - in the original, the toy level was one of my least favourites, but in the new version the entire stage takes place in a giant child's bedroom. That kind of context makes all the difference. The stage in Lost World would be a lot more appealing if it was a candy factory, or something along those lines.

It's perplexing that a candy stage and a honeycomb forest stage fall under the "Desert Ruins" zone name, but at least it bodes well for variety!

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