Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

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Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Farmer » Tue Sep 06, 2011 11:05 am

I'm honestly not sure, but this trailer with the confusing title seems to be advertising a cross-platform re-release of Sonic CD as if it was a new game.

Discuss.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Jingles » Tue Sep 06, 2011 1:58 pm

Would it be a possible Sonic CD HD?
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby K2J » Tue Sep 06, 2011 3:05 pm

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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Farmer » Tue Sep 06, 2011 3:13 pm

Reading existing threads? What's that?
Alright, yes, I'll move it.

Thread clean up in aisle #3.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Pepperidge » Tue Nov 01, 2011 7:11 pm

Yeah, so.... looks like Tails will be unlockable. I wonder what Amy will think of that.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Wombatwarlord777 » Tue Nov 01, 2011 8:36 pm

Huh. I wonder if they'll nerf Tails in any way since I assume he can fly. Maybe he'll be required to run a little longer before warping through time.

I suppose they wouldn't be doing this unless Tails was involved in Episode 2 of Sonic 4 somehow.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby FlashTHD » Tue Nov 01, 2011 8:47 pm

A couple of people at Retro assured me that this version will have your choice of both CD's original physics or the Genesis trilogy physics. I should hope the latter is optional, as not having the physics the game was freaking designed for would (to put it nicely) be like stealing the engine out of a Ferrari and switching it with one from a random Mercedes just for lulz.

Now as for Tails, that's a slick idea, and I like borrowing the Sonic 2 sprites, but I wonder what they've done about the special stages for him... draw new sprites from scratch, or ban him out of them altogether? (Wouldn't be unprecedented.)
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Locit » Wed Nov 02, 2011 3:41 am

FlashTHD wrote:A couple of people at Retro assured me that this version will have your choice of both CD's original physics or the Genesis trilogy physics. I should hope the latter is optional,

What, you mean, like you just said you were told they would be?
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby FlashTHD » Wed Nov 02, 2011 12:10 pm

Locit wrote:
FlashTHD wrote:A couple of people at Retro assured me that this version will have your choice of both CD's original physics or the Genesis trilogy physics. I should hope the latter is optional,

What, you mean, like you just said you were told they would be?

I should also hope you didn't stop reading the post at that point.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Locit » Wed Nov 02, 2011 1:45 pm

Well, obviously I didn't stop there. But beyond that point there's no purpose in waxing poetic about hypothetical misdeeds that, clearly and by your own admission, no one has committed. Basically I was just poking fun at your penchant for whining, which you'd think you'd be used to by now.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby gr4yJ4Y » Wed Nov 02, 2011 7:11 pm

We should move this to the news section. Sonic CD HD should have its own thread instead of posting in the Sonic 4 Episode II thread.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Arcade » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:34 am

Is a game remake and or port, and I bet the Sega CD version still plays better.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby P.P.A. » Mon Nov 07, 2011 6:25 pm

I would have bought a port or a remake, but I'm not touching a hack.
I was actually coming to terms with the alternate physics if they were just optional, but now Tails? There's merit in the Japanese's aversion towards hacks on the basis that these could be considered an insult to the original developer, since they imply that their work is not good or—in itself—perfect as it is. This is the case here. Adding bells and whistles would be fine, but completely tweaking the game's mechanics and making it play completely differently from how it originally did, and from how it was supposed to is just going too far.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby FlashTHD » Mon Nov 07, 2011 7:08 pm

P.P.A. wrote:I would have bought a port or a remake, but I'm not touching a hack.
I was actually coming to terms with the alternate physics if they were just optional, but now Tails? There's merit in the Japanese's aversion towards hacks on the basis that these could be considered an insult to the original developer, since they imply that their work is not good or—in itself—perfect as it is. This is the case here. Adding bells and whistles would be fine, but completely tweaking the game's mechanics and making it play completely differently from how it originally did, and from how it was supposed to is just going too far.

...so don't use Tails.

Jesus.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby P.P.A. » Tue Nov 08, 2011 2:16 am

 That's completely besides the point, this is a matter of principle. By hacking all sorts of shit into the game, it is implied that the game needs it and is less enjoyable without it.
 If they had wanted to put Tails in the game, they would have done so (he has two cameos, after all).
While I know the development team didn't have Naka's engine, I'm sure they could have made the game's physics work more similarly to Sonic 2's, but, instead, it is based on and derived from Sonic 1's mechanics, and led into a different direction.
 The game was made the way it was made because this is what the developers intended, and, as I believe, how the game is perfect. By tweaking with core mechanics like Sonic's movement or the spindash, and by adding completely new things that have nothing to do with the game (Tails in this case; as opposed to, say, bugfixes), the hacker implies that the game has to be to be “fixed”, and twists the original developers' visions.
 Yes, I could turn all these features off, but this is less about the personal game experience and more about the implications and mindset behind the “port”, which I strongly disagree with, if not find downright heretical.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Crisis » Tue Nov 08, 2011 3:15 am

I kinda agree with PPA on this one.

It's good that they left the option to disable Tails and the new physics, but the decision to include them to begin with is a sign of both disrespect and poor understanding of the original game.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Neo » Tue Nov 08, 2011 5:59 am

No it isn't. It's a sign that they're appealing to both those whole liked the original game as it was, and to those which marked down the game simply due to its blockier physics.

But hey, sure, go ahead and let your retardedness stand between you and a polished remake of a game you love.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Ritz » Tue Nov 08, 2011 4:06 pm

P.P.A. wrote:There's merit in the Japanese's aversion towards hacks on the basis that these could be considered an insult to the original developer, since they imply that their work is not good or—in itself—perfect as it is.

Is this actually a thing in Japan? Care to cite your sources? I mean, Nintendo had no qualms adding new content to their GBA Mario ports, and that alone sort of trounces this idea of games being immutable for fear of hurting someone's feelings! I'd think the notion of disrespect is much more of a concern to whiny fanchildren than it ever would be for any game developer. This is purely commercial work these people are doing, and the ones who harbor any considerable attachment to their work would likely love to see more content added when no game is ever complete. Only about half of the stuff planned for most games ever makes the cut. Oshima's not going to care about Sega tampering with a game he produced nearly 20 years ago, he has his own shit to deal with.

This really is unacceptably, irrevocably retarded!
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Blount » Tue Nov 08, 2011 4:39 pm

This is really just complaining for the sake of complaining. There will always, always be people out there who do it, no matter how ridiculous their reasons are. If they had decided to re-release the game with no changes at all, people would say the developers were lazy and only cared about making some quick, extra dough. And they did say that about this game a few years ago, so there.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Pepperidge » Tue Nov 08, 2011 5:34 pm

Just out of curiosity, has anyone here actually communicated with Taxman in any way about what capacity he personally implemented these alterations, and what capacity the changes were made by Sega? I'm very curious as to whether or not other things were added, like Time Attack runs for all versions of each stage rather than just Present. I'm also still really curious about how the cutscenes are going to be handled. If only Sega could get Toei to produce telecine HD remasters... I can't see that happening though.

Has there been any feedback at all about the tablet version that's floating around?
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Neo » Tue Nov 08, 2011 6:04 pm

Taxman is spearheading the entire project, it would seem. It's his engine, so essentially he pretty much determines what goes and what doesn't.

He's actually been replying to several questions about the game over at this thread on Sonic Retro, though he's also been downright ignoring some of them (like the ones you asked), so he's probably bound by some matter of draconian NDA. The intro cutscene now plays after starting a new game rather than by leaving the title screen idle, so new players won't accidentally miss it, but that's the extent of what we know about that.

We'll probably get a flood of information once the game hits sometime in December.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby FlashTHD » Tue Nov 08, 2011 11:12 pm

Pepperidge wrote:I'm very curious as to whether or not other things were added, like Time Attack runs for all versions of each stage rather than just Present.

I imagine that would have to facilitate changes to the unlockables system, because the non-cheat code extras were based on whittling that total time counter down to certain amounts, and adding more stages to it would become ridiculous.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby G.Silver » Wed Nov 09, 2011 1:14 am

Outside a time attack, I think it would have been neat just to set up a mode where you could play through just one time setting (ie, all Past, all Good Future, etc) without any time travel, just doing the levels in sequence without needing to do any warping around. The Future levels especially don't really give you any incentive to visit on their own, so making a whole "game" out of them would be a way to make better use of all that content.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Crisis » Wed Nov 09, 2011 2:33 am

Neo wrote:No it isn't. It's a sign that they're appealing to both those whole liked the original game as it was, and to those which marked down the game simply due to its blockier physics.

This is completely missing the point.

The physics were implemented the way they were for a reason. In fact they're probably what the developers spent the most time on, because every piece of level design stems from the physics engine. Changing them demonstrates a lack of understanding of the fundamental game design that went into the original product and can only make it worse. Maybe it will appeal to people who didn't like the original game, but I guarantee it will be unambiguously worse. We're not talking about a subtle tweak. We're talking about outright replacing the most important part of the game.

Changing a product for the worse is either a sign of incompetence or malice, there's no other way of looking at it. Maybe that doesn't matter to you, but if it were my game I would be hella pissed off.
Blount wrote:This is really just complaining for the sake of complaining. There will always, always be people out there who do it, no matter how ridiculous their reasons are. If they had decided to re-release the game with no changes at all, people would say the developers were lazy and only cared about making some quick, extra dough. And they did say that about this game a few years ago, so there.

Re-releasing games is obviously a lazy way of making money, but not only is that criticism completely valid, it's also completely besides the point, so I don't know why you brought it up.
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Re: Sega release trailer for.. Sonic CD? What?

Postby Neo » Wed Nov 09, 2011 3:54 am

Crisis wrote:This is completely missing the point.

No it's not.

Crisis wrote:The physics were implemented the way they were for a reason. In fact they're probably what the developers spent the most time on, because every piece of level design stems from the physics engine. Changing them demonstrates a lack of understanding of the fundamental game design that went into the original product and can only make it worse. Maybe it will appeal to people who didn't like the original game, but I guarantee it will be unambiguously worse. We're not talking about a subtle tweak. We're talking about outright replacing the most important part of the game.

Okay, you understand this. So the original physics are for you. The Sonic 2 physics are for the average Joe Idiot who doesn't know better and frowns upon the quirkier controls and ragequits because of it. The game then sells more copies, future budgets get higher and you're more likely to get HD rereleases of the original trilogy with online multiplayer and stereoscopic 3D.

Stop whining because you're getting all your greatest wishes and a bag of chips.
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