There is a Sonic webcomic and it is ok

[G.Silver]

SuitCase hired me to copy-edit a lot of the site and shop stuff ages ago. I have nothing to do with the comic, it sucks.

Hi Popcorn.

[Popcorn]

Hiya!

[G.Silver]

So it seems we now have the opportunity to own these comics (in book form)!

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/tae ... rody-comic

[Esrever]

Despite what their FAQ says, this is pretty dubious from a copyright perspective. But SEGA looks the other way on a lot of this kind of stuff, so it might not matter.

[Malchik]

These comics are a little pedestrian for me to actually want to own and re-read.

[SuitCase]

Despite what their FAQ says, this is pretty dubious from a copyright perspective. But SEGA looks the other way on a lot of this kind of stuff, so it might not matter.

Well, hopefully. Parody is a pretty wide definition in US and Australian law, but it's unpredictably applied. The truth of the matter is that if Sega were to challenge us, we'd immediately fold, and so we sell this book at their mercy.

I do feel that we have a moral obligation to ensure the work is as much "ours" as we can make it, and that it always remains a one-off side project alongside our own characters and ideas. There are other webcomics that tread uncomfortably close to what we consider (in a moral sense) unlicensed merchandise, and in the entire design of the strip (and this Kickstarter project) we've done our best to steer clear of that. Not just in the "hey we're not stealing sprites" sense, but also that it's transformative and, viewed as a whole, genuinely satirical. But this is a subjective matter, and I wouldn't challenge anybody who holds a narrower view of what is "fair use" in law and ethics.

P.S. G. Silver, while the barrel shirt wasn't actually inspired by your famous homepage picture, it did give me faith that people would like the reference. I'll try to remember to send you something extra when the project's over!

[G.Silver]

Despite what their FAQ says, this is pretty dubious from a copyright perspective. But SEGA looks the other way on a lot of this kind of stuff, so it might not matter.

How does this compare with stuff like the Life Meter comics that are based around several games, or that other Sonic parody book that you (Sam) contributed to but hasn't been reprinted? (That's sort of telling, perhaps!) Or Boxer Hockey's Sonic comic? (I believe he only sells that at cons?)

I do feel that we have a moral obligation to ensure the work is as much "ours" as we can make it, and that it always remains a one-off side project alongside our own characters and ideas. There are other webcomics that tread uncomfortably close to what we consider (in a moral sense) unlicensed merchandise, and in the entire design of the strip (and this Kickstarter project) we've done our best to steer clear of that. Not just in the "hey we're not stealing sprites" sense, but also that it's transformative and, viewed as a whole, genuinely satirical. But this is a subjective matter, and I wouldn't challenge anybody who holds a narrower view of what is "fair use" in law and ethics.

I guess the other question here is are those sprite-based comics being printed and sold? There's no doubt that as far as making these sorts of comics go, I think you can be pretty sure you're never going to get into trouble, but when you start selling it, that's when things start to get fishy. And then how you sell it probably matters too. I assumed this comic would also be a limited run, sold primarily to kickstarter backers plus some leftovers for cons, or do you plan on having it be something you continue to carry?

Also out of curiosity, how does it work where the books get upgraded to hardcovers? At $25 they do seem expensive for paperbacks (on the other hand, short run in full color shouldn't be surprising) so I assume it would be more a matter of if you ordered enough of them to bring the price of production for hardcovers down, rather than simply just raising more money? (I guess that makes a clear indication of what the extra money would be used for!)

P.S. G. Silver, while the barrel shirt wasn't actually inspired by your famous homepage picture, it did give me faith that people would like the reference. I'll try to remember to send you something extra when the project's over!

I'm flattered! But that was one of GG!'s illustrations, not mine! However, since he's probably dead in a Japanese rice mine I would happily accept on his behalf. ;D Edit: How about upgrading any GHZ backers' books to a signed edition that says "In Memory of Jared Matte?"

Congrats on making your goal so quickly!

[SuitCase]

I guess the other question here is are those sprite-based comics being printed and sold? There's no doubt that as far as making these sorts of comics go, I think you can be pretty sure you're never going to get into trouble, but when you start selling it, that's when things start to get fishy.

There are definitely examples of sprite comics that haven't gone to print for fear of legal reprisal (8-bit Theater!) but there are still many more non-sprite comics that seem to get by. In some cases, selling their books alongside accessory products that are hard to differentiate from unlicensed merchandise. And they all tend to draw their characters from a more litigious company...

The fact those comics seem to be safe, getting no pushback from the copyright owners or the wider community, encouraged me that we could make a go of this Not Enough Rings project, especially if I kept to my own moral principles of what's fair use and what's not (which would preclude a lot of stuff I've seen others get away with).

But, of course, right after this we're going to start selling the next Bittersweet Candy Bowl volume and going on with that because it's the thing we want to be known for. I actually suspect a few of the examples you named are limited-run not because of legal fears but because these people don't want the work to pigeonhole them as video game fan artists.

For NER, it'll be one print run and that's that. We mainly intend to sell the leftover books at cons at the side of the table.

hardcovers

Yeah, $25 is steep for softcovers (but please allow $5 for the included shipping, $2 for fees, remember it's full colour etc) but it's what I want to sell hardcovers at. It reflects the fact I had some hope that we'd scrape by the stretchgoal at the end, and I didn't want to be left selling them at a loss once they got the upgrade. Kickstarter costs can blow up pretty easily...

I'm flattered! But that was one of GG!'s illustrations, not mine

Is that true? What a dummy I am. I just remembered seeing it on your DA page recently, but it sounds like I must have misremembered. You didn't colour it or anything?

Well, thanks, GG!. Is he gone now?

[Esrever]

The problem with a work like Not Enough Rings -- and I use the word "problem" very loosely here, since I certainly don't have a problem with it personally -- is the visual derivation.

Narratively, it is clearly a direct parody. But visually, it's a recreation. It's not a Sonic-esque character in a Sonic-styled environment. It's Sonic in the GHZ. Every character design and environment is reproduced with pitch-perfect accuracy... albiet in a lavish, distinct artstyle! In the context of a book containing this work and absolutely nothing else, I think there's a danger of being found insufficiently transformative to qualify for fair use. Parody in the US is very irregularly protected and is primarily precedent based, but in general, it is much less generous in allowing use of visuals and particular character design (which is almost viewed in the same manner as logos) than it is with, say, the tune of a song... as many cartoonists who have tried to publish artwork making fun of Mickey Mouse will attest.

Of course, none of this really matters, because the way fair use ACTUALLY works is that if a corporation sends you a cease and desist, you stop, regardless of whether or not they are right, because you can't afford to take them on. WOO!

[G.Silver]

Is that true? What a dummy I am. I just remembered seeing it on your DA page recently, but it sounds like I must have misremembered. You didn't colour it or anything?

Nope, pure Gibbon.

Well, thanks, GG!. Is he gone now?

At least, he's not here. If he's still poking around the forum he hasn't logged in since last August.

[Locit]

At least, he's not here. If he's still poking around the forum he hasn't logged in since last August.

Wait, seriously? Any cataclysmic events in northern Japan lately?

Besides that one.

[G.Silver]

Last visited date is in his profile.

[Popcorn]

He finally figured out that all the cool kids leave.

Not Enough Rings obviously isn't parody and it's kind of stunning Suit is even going with that story. So I hope Sega doesn't deem to crush it. There wouldn't be anything in it for them. Sega, I mean. Or Suit, for that matter.

[Esrever]

Well, Aaron Webber actively told me to "keep making Sonic shirts", so there's that.

[Popcorn]

Did he cackle when he said that, by any chance?

[Locit]

Well, Aaron Webber actively told me to "keep making Sonic shirts", so there's that.

I love that kid. Has he bought any?

[Esrever]

He didn't cackle. But he did hand me some Sonic buttons!

I don't think he bought one. I figure Aaron is savvy enough to know it might not be doing folks favours to wear rad fan-made Sonic stuff in the eye of SEGA's legal department.

[The Doc]

The comic finished up last week, by the way, at least for the foreseeable future.

[G.Silver]

The books from the Kickstarter shipped, as well. I got one, anyway!

[Malchik]

Get one before the cease and desist order.