Avatar

[Dusk]

Even before I clicked on this thread, I knew in my heart, but I wanted to give the benefit of the doubt.

If in this forum's entire history it never had a single thread about fucking Avatar, I would have been entirely okay with it. This is worse than the Harry Potter thread.

Should... should I lock it? It's not breaking any rules per se, but Jesus, I mean I can't just let it devolve to this. Am I really that old?

What's interesting is there actually already was an Avatar thread, way back when. Perhaps everyone's just forgotten it by now or whatever. What strikes me as curious is that the response back then seemed notably positive around here. What went wrong in the ensuing three years to change everyone's mind?

[Majestic Joey]

I'll admit avatar is not the greatest show ever but in no way is it awful. I mean compared to pretty much any other American cartoon I've seen lately, avatar is better.

Except for the Venture Bros.

[Zeta]

What's interesting is there actually already was an Avatar thread, way back when. Perhaps everyone's just forgotten it by now or whatever. What strikes me as curious is that the response back then seemed notably positive around here. What went wrong in the ensuing three years to change everyone's mind?

It got popular, which on the internet means it now sucks and has sold out.

[Cuckooguy]

What are some good American cartoons lately? The most recent cartoon that I can think of that I quite liked was Justice League. Before that I liked X-Men Evolution and TMNT, though I lost interest in TMNT at some point in the series and X-Men Evolution had a crappy last season. Is Avatar really the best cartoon that America has been able to dish out lately?

[Dusk]

It's pretty high up there, in any case. I personally enjoyed the show; the good story and great animation were a nice breath of fresh air from the American cartoon norm.

[Majestic Joey]

Venture Bros is the only other show I can think of.

[One Classy Bloke]

Having just watched an episode now, I'm reminded of one of the key frustrations I find with the series. Avatar is very heavily influenced by asian legend and culture, with the creators clearly having done masses of research. They've internalised realms of information and reorganised it to develop this series. It can be considered the best application of this current fad in western animation so far.

But on this note, it is a missed effort. I would prefer to see an animated series more influenced by western culture and history, which doesn't descent into another oh so typical Tolikin-style fantasy. The effort shoved into this series doesn't prevent it from being any more than just the best of a current fad, and I doubt is really a timeless classic in the same way as Ren and Stimpy, early to mid Simpsons or Dexter's Lab is. Being so anime in style doesn't help either.

[G.Silver]

That's an interesting take and it actually matches my feelings pretty closely. Well-researched or not, I burned out on "fantasy asia" (china specifically) after watching Fushigi Yuugi in its entirety, and that was about 10 years ago. Avatar does make use of a more western style of storytelling from what I've seen, or at least I've seen a couple "moralistic" episodic shows that follow traditional American kids shows, and I thought that was interesting.

I'd really like to see more shows based on western or especially American historic culture. I remember watching "O Brother Where Art Thou" shortly after coming back from Japan and just being blown away, like "hey, WE have some culture, too!" The never-picked-up Amazing Screw On Head pilot admittedly only takes US history as its setting (that and Abe Lincoln) and doesn't really have anything else to do with it, but it would have been interesting to see where it went from there.

[Pepperidge]

Honestly, I thought the Avatar ending was a let down. I mean, yeah... the characters had resolved everything they set out to do with the highest production values possible. But that was it. There were no revelations, no significant pay-offs for pretty much any subplots, no deaths or any conceivable losses at the price of victory, and nothing more than rudimentary resolution for the characters (and pretty much none at all for Toph who was more "just there" than ever). The lack of any of this paints a considerable contrast to the type of storytelling that anyone should be expecting from the series at this point. Also, like Harry Potter's ending, it provided no real insight on the actual impact that any of this had on the world, which I really feel is something that a story that spends so much time establishing a fictional world needs to shed light on.

Venture Bros is the only other show I can think of.

And Spectacular Spider-Man, which you all must watch. Seriously, it's better than Avatar for the most part. And in the grand scheme of things, Avatar was pretty excellent.

[Zeta]

I'd really like to see more shows based on western or especially American historic culture. I remember watching "O Brother Where Art Thou" shortly after coming back from Japan and just being blown away, like "hey, WE have some culture, too!" The never-picked-up Amazing Screw On Head pilot admittedly only takes US history as its setting (that and Abe Lincoln) and doesn't really have anything else to do with it, but it would have been interesting to see where it went from there.

I know a couple of budding authors who keep on trying to do "Fantasy version of Revolutionary War Era US" as a setting, but they never get picked up by anyone. : (

[Crazy Penguin]

I've not seen much of Avatar, but I found it absolutely refreshing to see a contemporary cartoon series that doesn't look like crap. They actually put some money, talent and effort into this thing.

[Oompa Star]

I would assume that American history and culture gets put in the back seat because of how long it has been a country (almost 250 years). Compare that to China or most European countries, which go as far back as the B.C. period, there is just so much more recorded history and culture to sift through. Besides that, medieval and oriental culture just sells better with preteens, as it pertains to their wild fantasies.

[Ritz]

But what a wild 250 years it's been, am I right? I'd love to see some sort of anime series that takes place during the Roaring 20s.

I would, anyway, if anime wasn't inherently terrible. Who's with me?!

[Zeta]

But what a wild 250 years it's been, am I right? I'd love to see some sort of anime series that takes place during the Roaring 20s.

Baccano. Watch it. It's awesome.

[Cuckooguy]

Generally, when fiction is based off an area of the Earth of the past, then

America=Cowboys or Pilots
Japan=Samurai and Ninja
Europe=Knights and Sorcery or Pirates

[Locit]

Baccano. Watch it. It's awesome.

Yeah, seriously, watch Baccano. It's, uh, pretty much exactly what you're looking for.

[Ritz]

Baccano. Watch it.

Yeah, seriously, watch Baccano.

I think I might watch Baccano.

I will, anyway, as soon as I have more than 44MB of disc space to my name. My mother discovered the joys of pirating, and attempting to barter with her is a suicide mission. ("Well, how much shit do you have on your side? Goddamn you're selfish." "I keep telling you, mother, I've practically deleted everything I own already! Mother, please...")

[Pepperidge]

The opening is what tends to sell most people on the series.

[Zeta]

It's based on one book in a rather lengthly series of comedy/adventure/fantasy/crime novels. I wish they would adapt the other books, too.

[Ritz]

The opening is what tends to sell most people on the series.

Well, naturally, the first thing I did was look up the opening on Youtube. Naturally.

[Locit]

I will, anyway, as soon as I have more than 44MB of disc space to my name. My mother discovered the joys of pirating, and attempting to barter with her is a suicide mission. ("Well, how much shit do you have on your side? Goddamn you're selfish." "I keep telling you, mother, I've practically deleted everything I own already! Mother, please...")

Dude just stream it. Unless you've just got to have high quality, I guess.

[Crazy Penguin]

http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page ... e&id=17403

Umm. Huh.

I... Yeah. Hmm.

It's very...

(Whoever thought it would be a good idea to use the current version of Blue Beetle, debuted 2006 in the comics, deserves a kick to the groin.)

[Zeta]

The current version of Blue Beetle kicks ass, and he's got the best supporting cast in comics period. I always found the old two to be kind of lame, unless Booster Gold was with them. On their own, they didn't really do too well for me. Ted, like Martian Manhunter, was one of those characters that works only as a supporting cast member or part of a large ensemble.

[Crazy Penguin]

I've nothing against the current Blue Beetle, he just sticks out like a sore thumb in the otherwise retro-styled new Batman cartoon.

[Zeta]

Yeah, it's weird to see him in the same cartoon as YOUNG Green Arrow. I guess it's like when they decided to use Wally West as the first and only Flash in the Justice League cartoon. I think he was only put in the cartoon because he's young and hispanic.

I'm trying to think of characters Batman works well with. Black Canary, Huntress, Plastic Man, Black Lightning, Green Arrow, Zantanna, Etrigan, and Katanna are the only ones that leap to mind as "fitting" Batman very well.